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Weight Loss Forum / Low Carb / February 2005Low carb and diabetes prevention
I have a family history of diabetes. I'm wondering if a low carb diet will prevent me from developing it, assumed I continue with maintenance. Nick :: I have a family history of diabetes. I'm wondering if a low carb :: diet will prevent me from developing it, assumed I continue with :: maintenance. Very likely. Read up here: http://www.geocities.com/lottadata4u/index.htm > I have a family history of diabetes. I'm wondering if a low carb diet will > prevent me from developing it, assumed I continue with maintenance. You could well preserve more of your beta cells that way, thus preserving your ability to produce insulin. Check out Gretchen Becker's book(s) on delaying the onset of type 2 diabetes. Priscilla >I have a family history of diabetes. I'm wondering if a low carb diet will >prevent me from developing it, assumed I continue with maintenance. Don't forget the other half of the equation, exercise. Keeping your weight in normal bounds and keeping fit would be a huge help, but not a guarantee of avoiding diabetes. Nicky.  SignatureA1c 10.5/4.5/<6 Weight 95/78/72Kg 1g Metformin, 87.5ug Thyroxine T2 DX 05/2004 > I have a family history of diabetes. I'm wondering if a low carb diet will > prevent me from developing it, assumed I continue with maintenance. > > Nick Absolutely... This book is a must read for you. It may save your life. Dr. Bernstein's Diabetes Solution: The Complete Guide to Achieving Normal Blood Sugars Revised & Updated by Richard K. Bernstein http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0316099066/qid=1108587185/sr=2-1/ref=pd_b bs_b_2_1/104-5855203-9647139 Read the reviews. It treats diabetes T1 and T2 with a low carb approach. Good luck. TC Yes, a low carb diet can help. You should especially try to cut out high-glycemic carbs. Also, don't think that you can get away with using artificial sweeteners. They have been linked to T2 diabetes. ------------------------------- www.urine-pimp.com "pass your urine test" > Yes, a low carb diet can help. You should especially try to cut out > high-glycemic carbs. Also, don't think that you can get away with using > artificial sweeteners. They have been linked to T2 diabetes. Huh? Artificial sweeteners have been linked to T2 diabetes? Could've fooled me (as one person who drinks diet soda and has improved insulin response through low carb and exercise). SignatureBob in CT > Huh? Artificial sweeteners have been linked to T2 diabetes? Could've > fooled me (as one person who drinks diet soda and has improved insulin > response through low carb and exercise). People who use a lot of artificial sweeteners are usually doing it because they are overweight. 80% of type 2 diabetics are overweight at diagnosis. That is the link. Linked does not mean the same thing as caused. SignatureNo Husband Has Ever Been Shot While Doing The Dishes > People who use a lot of artificial sweeteners are usually doing it because > they are overweight. 80% of type 2 diabetics are overweight at diagnosis. > That is the link. Linked does not mean the same thing as caused. Exactly. The OP's claim of an association between use of artificial sweeteners and diabetes is just the kind of junk science found on those stupid websites... which is where he/she probably found it. I've never seen any *legitimate* claim for any causal relationship. HG > Yes, a low carb diet can help. You should especially try to cut out > high-glycemic carbs. Also, don't think that you can get away with > using artificial sweeteners. They have been linked to T2 diabetes. Put up or shut up Stephen. Carmen SignaturePlease note change in Reply To address carmensrt <at> gmail <dot> com Hotmail isn't working and is being abandoned On 16 Feb 2005 13:27:38 -0800 in alt.support.diet.low-carb, usenet69@hotmail.com wrote, >Also, don't think that you can get away with using >artificial sweeteners. They have been linked to T2 diabetes. I don't believe that. Please cite the source of your information. > I have a family history of diabetes. I'm wondering if a low carb diet will > prevent me from developing it, assumed I continue with maintenance. Unlike other posters here, I am not so sure if low carbing really prevents diabetes, as opposed to merely postponing it. There is no evidence to say that diabetes can be completely prevented with LC. The Diabetes Prevention Program study found that exercise and low FAT low cal diet, combined with weight loss, did reduce incidence of diabetes in the three years that it was conducted. Unfortunately, we do not know what would happen beyond those 3 years. Nor did they evaluate a low CARB diet. I am not aware of any long term studies that would say that LC prevents diabetes. That's not really an argument against low carbing, since it is better to be a slim diabetic than a fat diabetic. Our ability to process sugars, which is impaired in diabetics, may be declining just as it would without dieting, but with LC, we are not exercising this ability much since we eat much less sugars, so we are not seeing effects of its decline. I am aware of the argument that high blood sugars kill beta cells and that LC reduces that effect, but the real issue is lack of regeneration of beta cells in diabetics, as opposed to normal people. My point is that it remains to be proven whether or not LC prevents diabetes, but I would not be surprised to learn that it only postpones it. I would personally take even postponement. Signature223/172.9/180 Check out this epidemiological study (with the known limitations of epidemiological studies): High-fat, low-carbohydrate diet and the etiology of non-insulin-dependent diabetes mellitus: the San Luis Valley Diabetes Study. Marshall JA, Hamman RF, Baxter J. Department of Preventive Medicine and Biometrics, University of Colorado Health Sciences Center, Denver 80262. Diet has long been believed to be an important risk factor for non-insulin-dependent diabetes. Animal studies generally support a relation between high-fat diets and development of insulin resistance. However, conclusive epidemiologic evidence is lacking. To further investigate the role of dietary fat and carbohydrate as potential risk factors for the onset of non-insulin-dependent diabetes mellitus, current diet was assessed among a geographically based group of 1,317 subjects without a prior diagnosis of diabetes who were seen in the period from 1984 to 1988 in two countries in southern Colorado. In this study, 24-hour diet recalls were reported prior to an oral glucose tolerance test. Persons with previously undiagnosed diabetes (n = 70) and impaired glucose tolerance (n = 171) were each compared with confirmed normal controls (n = 1,076). The adjusted odds ratios relating a 40-g/day increase in fat intake to non-insulin-dependent diabetes mellitus and impaired glucose tolerance were 1.51 (95% confidence interval 0.85-2.67) and 1.62 (95% confidence interval 1.09-2.41), respectively. Restricting cases to diabetic persons with fasting glucose greater than 140 mg/dl and persons with impaired glucose tolerance confirmed on follow-up, the odds ratios increased to 3.03 (95% confidence interval 1.07-8.62) and 2.67 (95% confidence interval 1.33-5.36), respectively. The findings support the hypothesis that high-fat, low-carbohydrate diets are associated with the onset of non-insulin-dependent diabetes mellitus in humans. PMID: 1951264 Signature223/172.9/180 > Check out this epidemiological study (with the known limitations of > epidemiological studies): [quoted text clipped - 36 lines] > -- > 223/172.9/180 Now Colorado is a big state but two countries? I don't think so. Notice the 24-hour diet recall? That's how they inferred the high-fat diet. :: Check out this epidemiological study (with the known limitations of :: epidemiological studies): [quoted text clipped - 32 lines] :: diets are associated with the onset of non-insulin-dependent :: diabetes mellitus in humans. I think this proves nothing at all, which really means it's terrible as it spreads misinformation. Just think about it -- this suggests that a LC diet brings on T2 diabetes, yet, many of us here use it to control T2 diabetics and get completely off of meds. Obviously, the authors of this study were attempting to vilify fat in diet in favor of a low fat, high carb diet. These undiagnosed T2s were eating who knows what prior to the 24-hour diet recall...so following up with an extra 40g of fat with some unknown amount of carbs probably just meant they had overeaten, which can't be good for a T2. > :: Check out this epidemiological study (with the known limitations of > :: epidemiological studies): [quoted text clipped - 50 lines] > they > had overeaten, which can't be good for a T2. That is one of the worst studies ever. To give someone 40g more of fat per day and then conclude that low-barb diets are associated with diabetes is obscene. What about a group that actually goes on a low carb diet? Naturally, they wouldn't do that, as then they couldn't draw their idiotic conclusion. SignatureBob in CT :: On Thu, 17 Feb 2005 13:15:22 -0500, Roger Zoul :: <rogerzoul2@hotmail.com> wrote: [quoted text clipped - 60 lines] :: a low carb diet? Naturally, they wouldn't do that, as then they :: couldn't draw their idiotic conclusion. Right. I find it hard to trust any study about diet done in the 80s. (though, what Ig posted doesn't say when the study was done). >:: Check out this epidemiological study (with the known limitations of >:: epidemiological studies): [quoted text clipped - 45 lines] > extra 40g of fat with some unknown amount of carbs probably just meant they > had overeaten, which can't be good for a T2. All of these are vaid objections, yes (that's why I mentioned limitations of epidemiological studies). It's also possible that those prediabetics and diabetics were trying to treat themselves with low carb. There are more disconcerting rat studies though, that show that giving rats fat increases their insulin resistance. We are not rats and we may be better suited to eating fat than rats. Signature223/172.9/180 :: On Thu, 17 Feb 2005 13:15:22 -0500, Roger Zoul :: <rogerzoul2@hotmail.com> wrote: [quoted text clipped - 60 lines] :: rats fat increases their insulin resistance. We are not rats and we :: may be better suited to eating fat than rats. Memory fails me right now...but I recall that doing a ratio of trigs to something (total chol, hdl, or other) is supposed to be considered indicative (by some researcher) of ones insulin resistance. I do recall using my latest set of numbers to find that I would be in the group with very good insulin sensitivity (low IR) even though I'm a t2 diabetic. I eat a diet that is high in fat. Yes, we are not rats. I find it hard to believe that many undiagnosed diabetics were trying to treat themselves with LC in the 80s. >:: On Thu, 17 Feb 2005 13:15:22 -0500, Roger Zoul >:: <rogerzoul2@hotmail.com> wrote: [quoted text clipped - 68 lines] > even though I'm a t2 diabetic. I eat a diet that is high in fat. > Yes, we are not rats. The studies of trigs/HDL ratio were not done specifically on low carbing people, but rather on those who ate whatever they wanted. > I find it hard to believe that many undiagnosed diabetics were trying to > treat themselves with LC in the 80s. Possibly, you are right. In any case, we do not have a good basis to conclude that LC prevents diabetes. Signature223/172.9/180 :: On Thu, 17 Feb 2005 13:40:01 -0500, Roger Zoul :: <rogerzoul2@hotmail.com> wrote: [quoted text clipped - 76 lines] :: The studies of trigs/HDL ratio were not done specifically on low :: carbing people, but rather on those who ate whatever they wanted. I eat what I want, so does that make the results not apply to me? :) ::: I find it hard to believe that many undiagnosed diabetics were ::: trying to treat themselves with LC in the 80s. :: :: Possibly, you are right. In any case, we do not have a good basis to :: conclude that LC prevents diabetes. I disagree. It just doesn't exist in the medical literature - and it probaby won't, as financial interests are strong. > I find it hard to believe that many undiagnosed diabetics were trying to > treat themselves with LC in the 80s. Actually, they may have been - because LC was a very popular diet in the 70s, and in fact was the diabetic diet back in the 70s too. Not that it excuses that daft study. Nicky. SignatureA1c 10.5/4.5/<6 Weight 95/78/72Kg 1g Metformin, 87.5ug Thyroxine T2 DX 05/2004 >> I find it hard to believe that many undiagnosed diabetics were trying to >> treat themselves with LC in the 80s. > > Actually, they may have been - because LC was a very popular diet in the > 70s, and in fact was the diabetic diet back in the 70s too. Not that it > excuses that daft study. Nicky, do you know what was the reason why LC stopped being "the diabetic diet", after 1970s. Just curious. Signature223/172.9/180 >>> I find it hard to believe that many undiagnosed diabetics were trying to >>> treat themselves with LC in the 80s. [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > Nicky, do you know what was the reason why LC stopped being "the > diabetic diet", after 1970s. Just curious. No, I don't. I found that out by talking to a couple of friends who trained as nurses in the 70s and who were absolutely horrified at the dietary advice I was given at diagnosis; they had no theories as to why it has changed either. There's a sort of urban legend amongst diabetics that it's because a lot of diabetics died of heart attacks whilst on low carb diets, and so the impetus changed from treating the high blood sugar to treating the cardiac risk; but as you know, cardiac risk markers often lower with low carbing anyway. I guess Atkins and the general kidney scare stupidity didn't help either. One of life's great mysteries. Nicky. SignatureA1c 10.5/4.5/<6 Weight 95/78/72Kg 1g Metformin, 87.5ug Thyroxine T2 DX 05/2004 >>>> I find it hard to believe that many undiagnosed diabetics were trying >>>> to [quoted text clipped - 27 lines] > > Nicky. I think it's just the US Government pushing the low fat theory down everyone's throats. After all, they'd look hypocritical if they advocated low fat for everyone but diabetics. SignatureBob in CT >I have a family history of diabetes. I'm wondering if a low carb diet will >prevent me from developing it, assumed I continue with maintenance. > >Nick It may slow it rather than stop it, depending on how damaged you already are. I was well on the way to T2 when I first began LC almost 7 years ago. My blood tests at 6 months showed that I was close to the 'cut-off' point, and my doctor estimated I had another 6 months, tops, to become diabetic. In fact, it took 3 years and a couple of major shocks (the sudden and unexpected death of my 59 year old mother, followed very closely by abdominal surgery) to put me over the line. If you've not done a lot of damage to yourself already, you might be able to postpone T2 until significantly longer than your life expectancy. It's not a guarantee that you won't get there, though. Aramanth >>I have a family history of diabetes. I'm wondering if a low carb diet will >>prevent me from developing it, assumed I continue with maintenance. [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > > Aramanth I'm only 20 now, but was 310lbs since I was 14. I have gotten down to 210, hoping to get to 180 in the coming months. My overall lifestyle has changed, and it will undoubtably last for a lifetime. I'm just concerned that I'm delaying the inevitable, as so many relatives have this issue. > I'm only 20 now, but was 310lbs since I was 14. I have gotten down to 210, > hoping to get to 180 in the coming months. My overall lifestyle has changed, > and it will undoubtably last for a lifetime. I'm just concerned that I'm > delaying the inevitable, as so many relatives have this issue. Delaying the inevitable disease is a good thing. Signature223/172.9/180 >>>I have a family history of diabetes. I'm wondering if a low carb >>>diet will prevent me from developing it, assumed I continue with [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] > concerned that I'm delaying the inevitable, as so many relatives have > this issue. All the more reason for you to get your weight, diet, and exercise life under control asap. Even if you one day become diabetic, it is much, much better for that to happen when you're 60 as opposed to 23. I advise you to think very carefully about that. >I'm only 20 now, but was 310lbs since I was 14. I have gotten down to 210, >hoping to get to 180 in the coming months. My overall lifestyle has changed, >and it will undoubtably last for a lifetime. I'm just concerned that I'm >delaying the inevitable, as so many relatives have this issue. Delaying is good. REALLY good. At your age, you have the chance to delay diabetes for a good long time, quite possibly to beyond your currant life expectancy if you keep up the good work - but if you hadn't started taking care of yourself now you might well have become diabetic before you were 40 as I did. I wish *I* had known at 20 about LC and how healthy a lifestyle it can be. Aramanth > I have a family history of diabetes. I'm wondering if a low carb diet will > prevent me from developing it, assumed I continue with maintenance. > > Nick www.diabetes-normalsugars.com/ gtoomey I have type 2 diabetes at present, but ever since low carbs it is under control. Three months ago reading 220 at fasting now it is 70-80 fasting after meals 114. Low carbs work. Good Luck. |
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