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Weight Loss Forum / Low Carb / February 2005OT I'm still alive
Ok,we were moving from one house to another, got phones turned off at the old house last thursday, but never got the phone turned on at the new house because the phone company sucks and they don't show up when they say they will. Then, Sunday night at the new house, while we were all asleep, around 2AM, three masked guys with shotguns kicked in the doors. They were wearing SWAT caps and jackets with "Police" on them. They brought us all out to the living room and made us lie down facing the floor. At first they said they were the cops and they suspected us of terrorist activities, then they started yelling that they wanted the drugs and the money and the guns. They took about 300 bucks from my dad's pants pocket, the small tv from our roommate's room, and my 6 year old iMac. We don't know if the people who rented the house before us were dealing drugs, or if the guys just saw us moving in and figured we were an easy target because we weren't settled in yet, or if the movers told some friends that we didn't have a phone line yet and my roommate had a nice car so they figured we had money or something. Anyway, we got out of there that night and slept at my uncle's apartment, and now we're in the process of moving into a condo we're going to rent from some cousins. Thankfully, none of us were hurt, but it's a pain in the a.s to have to move again. And, I really loved that house, it was a really nice place, and I spent so much time, money and effort painting and setting everything up, but we would never feel safe there. The condo's in a gated community but it's pretty small and dumpy, and we're having to get rid of a bunch of stuff, which might actually be a blessing in disguise because we have too much crap anyway. My cat's adjusting suprisingly well to being uprooted twice in a week, but I'm still a bit shaken up and can't eat much or sleep very long at a time. I'm at my sister's house using her computer right now, and her husband may be able to lend me one until I can afford a new one. I'll try to check in again when I can get a break and get back over here. Top posting only to leave in the info - Luna, what a horrible ordeal! I cannot imagine how you must have felt! Scary! Take care of yourself, and let us know how you are doing. > Ok,we were moving from one house to another, got phones turned off at > the old house last thursday, but never got the phone turned on at the [quoted text clipped - 30 lines] > me one until I can afford a new one. I'll try to check in again when I > can get a break and get back over here. >> Ok,we were moving from one house to another, got phones turned off at >> the old house last thursday, but never got the phone turned on at the [quoted text clipped - 30 lines] >> me one until I can afford a new one. I'll try to check in again when I >> can get a break and get back over here. Holy sh.t!!! hope things get better. Lori Oh, Luna, how awful! I'm so sorry this happened. I hope everything looks up for you. In news:wiSQd.2$f04.1@fe56.usenetserver.com, luna <lunachick@mindspring.com> stated | Ok,we were moving from one house to another, got phones turned off at | the old house last thursday, but never got the phone turned on at the [quoted text clipped - 31 lines] | may be able to lend me one until I can afford a new one. I'll try to | check in again when I can get a break and get back over here. Holy crap Luna! Damn, I'm glad you guys didn't get hurt! Although the real cops probably won't be able to track these bastards unless someone squeals we can hope. Take care, Carmen > Ok,we were moving from one house to another, got phones turned off > at [quoted text clipped - 55 lines] > I > can get a break and get back over here.  SignaturePlease note change in Reply To address carmensrt <at> gmail <dot> com Hotmail isn't working and is being abandoned Luna, please accept my condolences. If people broke into my house with guns etc, in the middle of the night, they would quite possibly get shot by me. Signature223/172.9/180 > Luna, please accept my condolences. > > If people broke into my house with guns etc, in the middle of the > night, they would quite possibly get shot by me. My friend Gary said the fact that they were shouting "police" when they smashed the doors in would probably make him hesitate to shoot them, even though he keeps a loaded gun by his bed. I know I was only half awake anyway, and it happened so damn fast I didn't even realize it wasn't a dream until I was being pushed into the living room. It took a while to even process the clues that they weren't really police too. I mean, you do hear about cops doing drug raids at the wrong address, and that's what I thought it was at first, just a mistake. >> Luna, please accept my condolences. >> [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > mean, you do hear about cops doing drug raids at the wrong address, and > that's what I thought it was at first, just a mistake. What an upsetting story. It's probably difficult to wake up quickly enough to shoot intruders in time. I am glad that yo two are alive, and would not shed a tear if the robbers were killed. Signature223/172.9/180 damn... im sorry that had to happen to you. Signature_____________________________ This be Tia's SIG!!! YAY! >>> Luna, please accept my condolences. >>> [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > enough to shoot intruders in time. I am glad that yo two are alive, > and would not shed a tear if the robbers were killed. Oh, Luna, I am so sorry! What a horrible experience. > > Luna, please accept my condolences. > > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > smashed the doors in would probably make him hesitate to shoot them, > even though he keeps a loaded gun by his bed. Exactly. Ig, I think very few law-abiding people would be likely to shoot someone who burst in shouting "Police! Freeze!" if the home invaders were putting up even a slightly believable impersonation of same. T. > Oh, Luna, I am so sorry! What a horrible experience. > [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > invaders were putting up even a slightly believable impersonation of > same. It an interesting statement when someone says they'd start shooting at several people who busrt in, in the middle of the night, with no warning and with guns. shows just how dangerous people with guns can possibly be, to themselves and others, IMO. > It an interesting statement when someone says they'd start shooting at > several people who busrt in, in the middle of the night, with no warning and > with guns. shows just how dangerous people with guns can possibly be, to > themselves and others, IMO. Well, not a gun nut here, but can you think of a *better* time to start shooting? Yeah, I mean if the other people didn't have guns it would be safer, but rather less sporting, and besides it would take away the whole "self defense" slant if they'd burst in armed with plastic light sabers. And, who better to start shooting at than someone who bursts in with no warning and w/ guns? Martha SignatureSig pending > >> It an interesting statement when someone says they'd start shooting at [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > Well, not a gun nut here, but can you think of a *better* time to start > shooting? Good point. Strictly speaking, a sunny day at a gun range _would_ be a better time to start shooting, but sometimes we do not choose circumstances. I am not a drug dealer and see no reason why the police should suspect me of being one. So, if people break in with guns and shout something incomprehensible, I can assume that they are not police, and I will shoot. I am relatively good at shooting from the hip, by the way, due to time spent training doing just that. Thankfully, we have a constitutional amendment that protects out right to keep and bear arms. ________~._____ !\ ---------_:~ ____===_:-----W====!==____ }W ____-----\: /"| | ~~~~~ ~~~~~~ -~~ ||~~ \ \ ~ \_\ ``A well regulated militia, being necessary for the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms shall not be infringed.'' > ``A well regulated militia, being necessary for the security of a free > State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms shall not be > infringed.'' Gun Control: The theory that a woman found dead in an alley, strangled with her panty hose, is somehow morally superior to a woman explaining to police how her attacker got that fatal bullet wound. >>> It an interesting statement when someone says they'd start shooting at >>> several people who busrt in, in the middle of the night, with no warning [quoted text clipped - 28 lines] > State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms shall not be > infringed.'' Hi Ignoramus My dad would have liked you. He was a competition shooter, he ran shoots in PA, helped run some in NY, was the president of a few shooting clubs and owned a gun shop, but eventually needed a better income. He also shot in the Bianchi Cup for a few years then gave it up after my mom passed on...he was going to go last year, but passed on before he had the chance. When I was a kid he was asked to be a professional team shooter. I don't remember for who. Much like his army career, he turned it down because he didn't want to be away from his family or drag us all over the world. I wanted him to do it. I was a great shot and really miss going to the shooting range. He wanted me to shoot in his matches, he said I was better then most of the guys there. I didn't because I was 15 at the time and scared that I might piss off the big men if I won. lol So I would just take photos for them, for a long time my camera bag was a blue Dillon bag. Angie > Hi Ignoramus > [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > be away from his family or drag us all over the world. I wanted him to do > it. Sounds great. > I was a great shot and really miss going to the shooting range. He wanted me > to shoot in his matches, he said I was better then most of the guys there. I > didn't because I was 15 at the time and scared that I might piss off the > big men if I won. lol So I would just take photos for them, for a long time > my camera bag was a blue Dillon bag. Unfortunately, I am not a great shot as far as precision shooting goes (with scope and all that), although I try to practice. We had a nanny who was, in the past, a "master of sports" in shooting and a member of some prestigious shooting team of some Soviet military academy. Signature223/172.9/180 >> Hi Ignoramus >> [quoted text clipped - 26 lines] > Unfortunately, I am not a great shot as far as precision shooting goes > (with scope and all that), although I try to practice. To me practice is the fun part!!! My big problem was that I always used my dads guns so obviously they were not callibrated correctly for me. My first shot was always off but then I could aim so much above/below the target so my second shot would be on target, third would be darn close to mark. > We had a nanny who was, in the past, a "master of sports" in shooting > and a member of some prestigious shooting team of some Soviet military > academy. Wow thats imprressive you must have learned a lot from this person. Angie Hi, > > Oh, Luna, I am so sorry! What a horrible experience. > > [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > can possibly > be, to themselves and others, IMO. I don't agree, and here's why: The homeowner knows the turf far better than the home invaders. If he/she has decided, in advance, that they will defend against force with force then that gives them an additional psychological advantage in addition to the first factor. The criminals will be expecting the victims to submit, and the failure of the homeowner to comply with the script as written may well give the homeowner those split seconds that can make all the difference. If the homeowner is familiar and skilled with their weapon fighting back isn't necessarily the wrong response. In the situation Luna was presented with, I'd have done exactly what she did *because* they looked like they were legit. The outcome would have been the same BUT if they hadn't appeared to be the authorities and I'd had a weapon available my choice might be different. It's one of those things people ought to decide in advance how they plan to deal with. Take care, Carmen Off to the Home Show! W00T! SignaturePlease note change in Reply To address carmensrt <at> gmail <dot> com Hotmail isn't working and is being abandoned > I don't agree, and here's why: The homeowner knows the turf far better > than the home invaders. If he/she has decided, in advance, that they [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > If the homeowner is familiar and skilled with their weapon fighting > back isn't necessarily the wrong response. The key, as with everything, is practice with a particular weapon and consistency in training. Signature223/172.9/180 More on the gun issue. Some people become very frustrated selling brass from fired cartridges: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=7135441836 Signature223/172.9/180 Hi, On 18-Feb-2005, Ignoramus29670 <ignoramus29670@NOSPAM.29670.invalid> wrote: > More on the gun issue. > > Some people become very frustrated selling brass from fired > cartridges: > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=7135441836 Thank you Ig - Howard and I couldn't stop laughing. The poor guy. Ebay really is the realm of the Rulemeister - and the mod bots exhibit all the intelligence of rocks. Take care, Carmen --- Please note change in Reply To address carmensrt <at> gmail <dot> com Hotmail isn't working and is being abandoned > > Luna, please accept my condolences. > > [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > mean, you do hear about cops doing drug raids at the wrong address, and > that's what I thought it was at first, just a mistake. Exactly why allowing police to "serve a warrant" by kicking down doors in the middle of the night was A Bad Thing. No being able to tell the good guys from the bad guys is the ultimate expression of the ends justifying the means. But hey, we wrapped that war on drugs up right quick and clean, didn't we? KeS its good that i dont care about the risk of being unpopular. it seems my opinions infuriate folks, but oh well. the war on drugs was the worst thing we ever did. if people want to kill themselves, let em. tax it and make money. /sigh. Signature_____________________________ This be Tia's SIG!!! YAY! >> > Luna, please accept my condolences. >> > [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > > KeS I'm sorry to hear about your ordeal, Luna. I would make a list of who knew what and try to make sense of it. I'm not sure I see the point of moving again. Emotionally, yes, you may not feel comfortable there, but now they know you are not drug dealers with mountains of cash.... > Ok,we were moving from one house to another, got phones turned off at > the old house last thursday, but never got the phone turned on at the [quoted text clipped - 30 lines] > me one until I can afford a new one. I'll try to check in again when I > can get a break and get back over here. > I'm sorry to hear about your ordeal, Luna. > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > feel comfortable there, but now they know you are not drug dealers with > mountains of cash.... Yeah, but if they thought we had stuff, then other people might too. >> I'm sorry to hear about your ordeal, Luna. >> [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] >> > Yeah, but if they thought we had stuff, then other people might too. Put an NRA sticker on your vehicle, it might help. Signature223/172.9/180 I agree with her that they should move as soon as possible. If the house was used by drug pushers in the past, I think she is right in thinking that different atttackers might come again in the future. I assume the police and the landlord/home owner know about her horrible experience. The house should be closely watched in the future so that anyone else who moves will get some protection. It's certainly a shame she and her family weren't told of the past history of the house. If the landlord/owner knew of past problems with the house, I wonder if she can sue for not being warned and therefore the safety of her and her family endangered. Barbara > > [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > > > > I'm sorry to hear about your ordeal, Luna. > > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > > Yeah, but if they thought we had stuff, then other people might too. people anywhere can think that, though. moving won't change that. > > Yeah, but if they thought we had stuff, then other people might too. > > people anywhere can think that, though. moving won't change that. I believe she said they moved to a condo in a gated community. Not that that is inherently safer, but if they feel safer that's a plus. HG > > > Yeah, but if they thought we had stuff, then other people might too. > > > > people anywhere can think that, though. moving won't change that. > > I believe she said they moved to a condo in a gated community. Not that that > is inherently safer, but if they feel safer that's a plus. feeling safer and actually being safer are two different things. i agree that living in a gated community reduces some of the risk - anyone wanting to get in there for illicit purposes will have to think twice and is likely to just go for something easier - but it doesn't sound like a great place to live for other reasons. and there's no guarantee that other people living *inside* the gated community wouldn't rip you off. don't get me wrong, i'm glad Michelle and her family are ok and i don't blame them for being rattled, i just don't think you can ever really escape from people wanting to do stupid/mean things. they're everywhere, even behind the gates of a gated condo community. >>>>Yeah, but if they thought we had stuff, then other people might too. >>> [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > escape from people wanting to do stupid/mean things. they're > everywhere, even behind the gates of a gated condo community. Oh, I totatlly agree. I'm never under the illusion that I'm perfectly safe anywhere. The best any of us can do is find a way to balance minimizing risks with having a life. I think it's actually a small chance that house was a drug house in the past, and a smaller chance we'd get broken into again. But, no matter the actuall percentage of risk, I don't think we'd ever be able to relax and enjoy ourselves in that house again. Just being over there in the day, with friends, to move our stuff, every time I heard a car drive by I'd stop what I was doing to listen if they slowed down outside the house or something. I don't know whether or not I'd ever be able to talk myself out of feeling tense there, but I do know it would take quite a long time if it could ever happen. > >>>>Yeah, but if they thought we had stuff, then other people might too. > >>> [quoted text clipped - 29 lines] > tense there, but I do know it would take quite a long time if it could > ever happen. i do understand, and i'm glad you're all ok. >> I'm sorry to hear about your ordeal, Luna. >> [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] >> > Yeah, but if they thought we had stuff, then other people might too. I agree with you Luna. Moving was the right thing if you ask me. Angie > Yeah, but if they thought we had stuff, then other people might too. Damn good point. Signature370/280/270 Single malt scotch is awesome (NO it does NOT have carbs as DON'T vodka, gin, rum, bourbon, etc generally) Malt can be made low carb through the judicious use of yeast. Low carb beer? Uh...yeah. Read the books. You can have more than eggs for breakfast. Yes calories do count. Ketosticks are not neccessary to lose weight. Email: Actually my feet are big not medium. Damn. Twlight Zone! I'm really glad you guys are okay. Hang tight!! > Then, Sunday night at the new house, while we were all asleep, around > 2AM, three masked guys with shotguns kicked in the doors. They were [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > the money and the guns. They took about 300 bucks from my dad's pants > pocket, the small tv from our roommate's room, and my 6 year old iMac. | Ok,we were moving from one house to another, got phones turned off at | the old house last thursday, but never got the phone turned on at the [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] | Then, Sunday night at the new house, while we were all asleep, around | 2AM, three masked guys with shotguns kicked in the doors. Geez Michelle, what a scary experience. I'm just glad you and your Dad and your roommate are ok -- physically anyway. I know that something like this has a lingering effect on your psyche. It feels like rape when your home is violated; I had something similar happen a few years ago and I had to move too; couldn't stay there another night. I firmly believe that there's a reason for everything that happens to us. Although you liked that house, it apparently wasn't the right place for you to be. Good things will come out of the move to your condo, wait and see! SignaturePeter http://users.thelink.net/marengo > I firmly believe that there's a reason for everything that happens to us. > Although you liked that house, it apparently wasn't the right place for you > to be. Good things will come out of the move to your condo, wait and see! That's a great way to look at it. Who knows, it might have happened again but with worse consequences, too. So maybe this was a relatively harmless, if traumatic, warning. Luna, I'm glad you all came out of this ok and were able to find somewhere else to move so quickly. HG > Ok,we were moving from one house to another, got phones turned off at > the old house last thursday, but never got the phone turned on at the > new house because the phone company sucks and they don't show up when > they say they will. ===================== What a nightmare! :-( SignatureWysong Age 60. Height 5'6" Starting date: 1/8/05 171/ 165 / 140 lb Starting date LC 7/01 at 207lbs Stopped losing on LC 11/01 at 165lbs ========================================== NOW WALKING 1.5 to 3 MILES DAY. ========================================== Crap - I forgot to get my official stamp of approval and sign the little document promising only to have thoughts that conform to the official ASDLC guidelines. I hate it when that happens. (credit Sophie) ~~<~~<~~{@ ~~<~~<~~{@ ~~<~~<~~{@ > Then, Sunday night at the new house, while we were all asleep, around > 2AM, three masked guys with shotguns kicked in the doors. They were [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > money and the guns. They took about 300 bucks from my dad's pants > pocket, the small tv from our roommate's room, and my 6 year old iMac. Jesus Christ, what an ordeal!! I'm glad you and your father (and roommate?) weren't physically hurt. I imagine the trauma will take some time to abate, though! SignatureSaffire 205/144/125 - 5'1.5" Atkins since 6/14/03 Progress photo: http://photos.yahoo.com/saffire333 > Then, Sunday night at the new house, while we were all asleep, around > 2AM, three masked guys with shotguns kicked in the doors. They were [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > money and the guns. They took about 300 bucks from my dad's pants > pocket, the small tv from our roommate's room, and my 6 year old iMac. Wow, Luna, that sucks! I hope they get the f.ckers who did that and string them up! Sorry to hear this happened. I'm glad that you were not hurt. Tom > Ok,we were moving from one house to another, got phones turned off at > the old house last thursday, but never got the phone turned on at the [quoted text clipped - 30 lines] > me one until I can afford a new one. I'll try to check in again when I > can get a break and get back over here. I'm sorry to hear about your ordeal. It's great that neither you or your family got physically injured. May be it's time to think of adding better security to your new home like stronger doors, sensors, etc. Have you by chance got any home insurance? <snipped> > Then, Sunday night at the new house, while we were all asleep, around > 2AM, three masked guys with shotguns kicked in the doors. They were [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > money and the guns. They took about 300 bucks from my dad's pants > pocket, the small tv from our roommate's room, and my 6 year old iMac. <snipped> I'm so sorry this happened to you and your family. Glad you are all safe. ----- 285.5/259/120 monthly-goal: 8 month-start: 265.5 <snip> Holy cow, Luna. {{{{{Hugs}}}}} SignatureMogget, the Churl in the Puce Greatcoat I'm glad you're physically unharmed, Luna. It's going to take a while to feel safe again but you will get there, I'm sure. Aramanth > Ok,we were moving from one house to another, got phones turned off at the > old house last thursday, but never got the phone turned on at the new [quoted text clipped - 30 lines] > one. I'll try to check in again when I can get a break and get back over > here. This must have been so scarry. I'm glad you didn't get hurt and that you are now safe. Angie >We don't know if the people who rented the house before us were dealing >drugs, or if the guys just saw us moving in and figured we were an easy >target because we weren't settled in yet, or if the movers told some >friends that we didn't have a phone line yet and my roommate had a nice >car so they figured we had money or something. Hello, I really don't know anyone here. My father was a private investigator. No he wasn't a bona fide policeman. But we still got all the juice. and the problems. When I first read this ordeal I thought that it may have been crooked cops. But then I read where they took money and items. crooked cops usually just want the drugs or the drug money. and when they make a mistake on their crooked take they arrest someone (suspicion) just to have had a reason to be there. So then I got thinking about criminals that would've had information about the mark. It's just too weird. So I'm left with this..... A team of bad guys case freeways looking for moving vans. They'll usually case the large trucks because they'll get large screen TV's and stereos and such. they are practiced in their deception and the actual police have probably been stumped because the bad guys probably case the highways and their crime spree spans entire states. I know this doesn't make you feel any better but if you had actually shot one of them, that would probably be the first time anyone has actually taken a stance against them, and it would be the beginning of the end for them. Criminals like this count on your submissiveness. And for what it's worth..... you're better off submitting. they didn't want a confrontation, they wanted your stuff. I'm so sorry you had to endure this. We had many times when people tried to kill my dad or intimidate us. once my brother and I were kidnapped, not for ransom, but for leverage. We all had to take gun safety lessons and learn how to fire a weapon. As a result I am capable of shooting to kill. To me it's just as easy as pointing my finger. I wouldn't hesitate, so therefore I won't own a gun. motion detectors go a long way to make you feel more confident with your surroundings. our basement windows all have alarms. not the kind that alert a security company, the kind that let out a 120 DB blast that scares the hell out of all involved. It's only gone off once in 17 years but whoever set it off was long gone before we even got out of bed. Good luck, and keep safe. Patti This makes no sense to me. If you are capable of shooting to kill you must be capable of shooting to wound and stop, such as taking out a kneecap, etc. -- Cheri >We all had to take gun safety lessons and learn how to fire a weapon. >As a result I am capable of shooting to kill. To me it's just as easy >as pointing my finger. I wouldn't hesitate, so therefore I won't own a >gun. > This makes no sense to me. If you are capable of shooting to kill you > must be capable of shooting to wound and stop, such as taking out a > kneecap, etc. A kneecap is difficult to hit. i >>We all had to take gun safety lessons and learn how to fire a weapon. >>As a result I am capable of shooting to kill. To me it's just as easy >>as pointing my finger. I wouldn't hesitate, so therefore I won't own a >>gun. Signature223/172.9/180 But the etc isn't. :-) -- Cheri Ignoramus8911 wrote in message ... >> This makes no sense to me. If you are capable of shooting to kill you >> must be capable of shooting to wound and stop, such as taking out a [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] >-- >223/172.9/180 The best tactic is to aim for center-of-mass. SignatureMost people are dumb as bricks; some people are dumber than that. -- MFW > This makes no sense to me. If you are capable of shooting to kill you > must be capable of shooting to wound and stop, such as taking out a [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] >>as pointing my finger. I wouldn't hesitate, so therefore I won't own a >>gun. > This makes no sense to me. If you are capable of shooting to kill you > must be capable of shooting to wound and stop, such as taking out a [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] >>as pointing my finger. I wouldn't hesitate, so therefore I won't own a >>gun. Wound and stop would give them a second chance at harming you. These people aren't in your house to be your friend. I would aim to kill. Marsha/Ohio Hi, Patti: > >>We all had to take gun safety lessons and learn how to fire a > >>weapon. As a result I am capable of shooting to kill. To me it's > >>just as > >>easy as pointing my finger. I wouldn't hesitate, so therefore I > >>won't > >>own a gun. > > This makes no sense to me. If you are capable of shooting to kill > > you must be capable of shooting to wound and stop, such as taking > > out > > a kneecap, etc. Marsha: > Wound and stop would give them a second chance at harming > you. These people aren't in your house to be your friend. > I would aim to kill. If they have a gun and they are *in* my house I wholeheartedly agree. If they only have a knife I'd shoot to stop them if they refused to leave when ordered. I say that because I'm a good shot and have enough knowledge of anatomy to know good places to aim for. It really does pay to run scenarios through in your mind ahead of time so that you don't lose precious time making decisions if the time comes. It's like "What would I do if someone grabbed me and threw me in their car?" My answer would be "Anything it takes. Kick out windows, turn and kick the steering wheel and/or driver, grab the keys if possible and chuck them out the window, poke the guy's eye with a finger. Yeah, I'll probably get injured, possibly badly, but it'd lessen the odds of my body showing up in a ditch or field a couple of days/weeks down the road." Damn, I'm a mean-assed liberal. <G> Take care, Carmen SignaturePlease note change in Reply To address carmensrt <at> gmail <dot> com Hotmail isn't working and is being abandoned > If they have a gun and they are *in* my house I wholeheartedly agree. > If they only have a knife I'd shoot to stop them if they refused to [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > so that you don't lose precious time making decisions if the time > comes. It also helps practicing, besides merely thinking. Acquiring odd placed targets quickly, going around obstacles with a weapon, etc. My favorite home defense weapon is a Kalashnikov. A very handy gun, plus, it also sends the right message to the person ordered to stop (if, say, I caught an unarmed burglar). A dead home invader is, also, preferable to a live and injured home invader who needs permanent medical care. That said, legally, we are only supposed to shoot to stop a threat. "Finishing off" an injured person is a crime, for good reasons. Let's be mindful of that. i Hi, On 19-Feb-2005, Ignoramus8911 <ignoramus8911@NOSPAM.8911.invalid> wrote: > > If they have a gun and they are *in* my house I wholeheartedly > > agree. If they only have a knife I'd shoot to stop them if they [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > only supposed to shoot to stop a threat. "Finishing off" an injured > person is a crime, for good reasons. Let's be mindful of that. Of course. My goal would be to stop the person. If an armed person saw me with a gun and dropped theirs I've gotten what I wanted - especially if they leave my house if ordered. The police will find them eventually. I just want them away from my family. Take care, Carmen SignaturePlease note change in Reply To address carmensrt <at> gmail <dot> com Hotmail isn't working and is being abandoned > Of course. My goal would be to stop the person. If an armed person > saw me with a gun and dropped theirs I've gotten what I wanted - > especially if they leave my house if ordered. The police will find > them eventually. I just want them away from my family. Carmen, Would that really satisfy you? Sure, they would be away from your family, but would the police find them in time before someone else's family was harmed? Marsha/Ohio >> Of course. My goal would be to stop the person. If an armed person >> saw me with a gun and dropped theirs I've gotten what I wanted - [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > from your family, but would the police find them in time > before someone else's family was harmed? That would definitely satisfy _me_. Signature223/172.9/180 Hi, > > Of course. My goal would be to stop the person. If an armed > > person saw me with a gun and dropped theirs I've gotten what I [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > from your family, but would the police find them in time > before someone else's family was harmed? No, it's not anything close to a perfect solution, but it's the best decision under the circumstances. If I try and maintain custody of them until law enforcement arrives they have more time to gain the upper hand and harm my family, or do something stupid and end up having to be shot. At a certain point I have to trust the police to do their job. Take care, Carmen SignaturePlease note change in Reply To address carmensrt <at> gmail <dot> com Hotmail isn't working and is being abandoned >>>Of course. My goal would be to stop the person. If an armed >>>person saw me with a gun and dropped theirs I've gotten what I >>>wanted - >>>especially if they leave my house if ordered. The police will >>>find them eventually. I just want them away from my family. >>Marsha: Would that really satisfy you? Sure, they would be away >>from your family, but would the police find them in time >>before someone else's family was harmed? > > Carmen: No, it's not anything close to a perfect solution, but it's the best > decision under the circumstances. If I try and maintain custody of > them until law enforcement arrives they have more time to gain the > upper hand and harm my family, or do something stupid and end up > having to be shot. > At a certain point I have to trust the police to do their job. I understand that that is the best decision for you under those circumstances. No one would actually enjoy killing someone. But if someone else in your neighborhood thought that way, your family could be the next target along with who knows how many others. Police response time on a busy weekend isn't very good around here. I would just shoot 'em and stop the whole cycle. Marsha/Ohio Hi, > >>>Of course. My goal would be to stop the person. If an armed > >>>person saw me with a gun and dropped theirs I've gotten what I [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] > weekend isn't very good around here. I would just shoot 'em > and stop the whole cycle. Naw, that's not me and I've thought about it enough to know it. It's the "liberal" gene I guess. :-) Take care, Carmen SignaturePlease note change in Reply To address carmensrt <at> gmail <dot> com Hotmail isn't working and is being abandoned > Hi, >> [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] >>weekend isn't very good around here. I would just shoot 'em >>and stop the whole cycle. Carmen: > Naw, that's not me and I've thought about it enough to know it. It's > the "liberal" gene I guess. :-) Well, okay then. That's not your fault any more than being messed up from living in Long Island : ) Marsha/Ohio >>>This makes no sense to me. If you are capable of shooting to kill >>>you must be capable of shooting to wound and stop, such as taking [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] >>you. These people aren't in your house to be your friend. >>I would aim to kill. Carmen: > If they have a gun and they are *in* my house I wholeheartedly agree. > If they only have a knife I'd shoot to stop them if they refused to > leave when ordered. I say that because I'm a good shot and have > enough knowledge of anatomy to know good places to aim for. Well, then they get to waste a bunch of taxpayers' money to go through the whole trial thing and eventually get out on probation to do it again. If you kill 'em, you don't have to worry about any of that (tongue firmly in cheek). > Damn, I'm a mean-assed liberal. <G> > Take care, > Carmen Yeah, but other then that, you're okay : p~~~ Marsha/Ohio Hi > > Marsha: > > [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > probation to do it again. If you kill 'em, you don't have > to worry about any of that (tongue firmly in cheek). Yeah well, this is Tennessee not Texas. TN doesn't have a "he needed killin' " defense. ;-) > > Damn, I'm a mean-assed liberal. <G> > > Yeah, but other then that, you're okay : p~~~ ;-) Take care, Carmen SignaturePlease note change in Reply To address carmensrt <at> gmail <dot> com Hotmail isn't working and is being abandoned > Hi >> > Marsha: [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > Yeah well, this is Tennessee not Texas. TN doesn't have a "he needed > killin' " defense. ;-) This is very difficult for Texans to understand. Yes, that includes me. Hi, > >> Well, then they get to waste a bunch of taxpayers' money to > >> go through the whole trial thing and eventually get out on [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > > Yes, that includes me. I was born in Texas (Lubbock) but living on Long Island for 10 years screwed with my head. ;-) Take care, Carmen SignaturePlease note change in Reply To address carmensrt <at> gmail <dot> com Hotmail isn't working and is being abandoned > Hi, > [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > I was born in Texas (Lubbock) but living on Long Island for 10 years > screwed with my head. ;-) It's not your fault then. ;-) > Yeah well, this is Tennessee not Texas. TN doesn't have a "he needed > killin' " defense. ;-) Even a 'make my day' law doesn't make it legal to shoot the guy in the back as he's running away from you. SignatureNo Husband Has Ever Been Shot While Doing The Dishes Yes Carmen, and as the old saying goes, "don't ask permission, ask forgiveness." ;-) -- Cheri >If they have a gun and they are *in* my house I wholeheartedly agree. >If they only have a knife I'd shoot to stop them if they refused to [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] >Please note change in Reply To address carmensrt <at> gmail <dot> com >Hotmail isn't working and is being abandoned So would I, and I've never lived in a house without a gun. :-) -- Cheri Marsha wrote in message ... >Wound and stop would give them a second chance at harming >you. These people aren't in your house to be your friend. >I would aim to kill. > >Marsha/Ohio >> This makes no sense to me. If you are capable of shooting to kill you >> must be capable of shooting to wound and stop, such as taking out a [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > Wound and stop would give them a second chance at harming you. These > people aren't in your house to be your friend. I would aim to kill. I was raised in an NRA household, and also did target shooting as a kid. I was taught that you never aim a gun at anyone unless you mean to kill them. brigid I would do the same. :-) -- Cheri Brigid Nelson wrote in message ... >I was raised in an NRA household, and also did target shooting as a kid. > I was taught that you never aim a gun at anyone unless you mean to >kill them. > >brigid >This makes no sense to me. If you are capable of shooting to kill you >must be capable of shooting to wound and stop, such as taking out a >kneecap, etc. I wouldn't shoot to wound. only kill. Patti I know. You said that's the reason you don't have a gun. So, you would sooner be unarmed than kill someone who is attacking you? It still makes no sense to me, but it doesn't have to make sense to me, if it makes sense to you, that's all that counts. :-) -- Cheri >>This makes no sense to me. If you are capable of shooting to kill you >>must be capable of shooting to wound and stop, such as taking out a [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > >Patti Maybe she's afraid she'll kill her kids or something. SignatureMost people are dumb as bricks; some people are dumber than that. -- MFW >I know. You said that's the reason you don't have a gun. So, you would > sooner be unarmed than kill someone who is attacking you? It still makes [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] >> >>Patti > Maybe she's afraid she'll kill her kids or something. Heh. Can't say that there haven't been times I've thought about doing away with SO and vice versa : ) BTW, when I reply to some messages (yours for instance), only your reply shows up. What happened to the rest of what you were quoting? Marsha/Ohio >> Maybe she's afraid she'll kill her kids or something. > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > BTW, when I reply to some messages (yours for instance), only your reply > shows up. What happened to the rest of what you were quoting? Haha. It's the magical post-condensing and limiting device. >>>Maybe she's afraid she'll kill her kids or something. >>Marsha wrote: >>Heh. Can't say that there haven't been times I've thought about doing >>away with SO and vice versa : ) >> >>BTW, when I reply to some messages (yours for instance), only your reply >>shows up. What happened to the rest of what you were quoting? > Haha. It's the magical post-condensing and limiting device. So that we may see only the great one's words? It can't be because of top posting; I've replied to other top posters and get the whole thing. Marsha/Ohio > >>>Maybe she's afraid she'll kill her kids or something. > [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > because of top posting; I've replied to other top posters > and get the whole thing. it's because he top posts and uses a sig delimiter, which is designed to prevent people from endlessly quoting other people's sigs. when used improperly, as by a top posting moron, it deletes entire conversations. hth. >>>>>Maybe she's afraid she'll kill her kids or something. >> [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > > hth. Thanks. >It can't be >because of top posting; I've replied to other top posters >and get the whole thing. > >Marsha/Ohio As others have said, it's the .sig delineator - that is, just before his .sig he has a line with "--" which tells your software to cut the quote at this point. You CAN overcome it if you really want to (although why you'd WANT to post to JC I can't imagine - I happily killfiled him months ago) simply by highlighting the whole page, including the area below the "-- " BEFORE you hit reply. In most newsreading software this tells you to quote everything highlighted. It's also a good way to pick out just the bit you want to reply to in a very long post - highlight the pertinent area, hit 'reply' and it will be all that shows up. Aramanth >> Maybe she's afraid she'll kill her kids or something. > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > Marsha/Ohio I promise not to be an a.s anymore. Sorry >>> Maybe she's afraid she'll kill her kids or something. >> [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] >> > I promise not to be an a.s anymore. Sorry Nice try, imposter. Marsha/Ohio > >> Maybe she's afraid she'll kill her kids or something. > > [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > > I promise not to be an a.s anymore. Sorry You can't make promises for JC, but you can make them for yourself. Can we count on *you* to not be an a.s anymore Bunky? Carmen SignaturePlease note change in Reply To address carmensrt <at> gmail <dot> com Hotmail isn't working and is being abandoned >>>>Maybe she's afraid she'll kill her kids or something. >>> [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > > Carmen I'll be an a.s all I want : sh.t for brains! > >>I promise not to be an a.s anymore. Sorry > > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > I'll be an a.s all I want : sh.t for brains! Bunky, why is the above sort of behavior wrong when JC does it but acceptable when you use it? Carmen SignaturePlease note change in Reply To address carmensrt <at> gmail <dot> com Hotmail isn't working and is being abandoned | > >>I promise not to be an a.s anymore. Sorry | > > [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] | | Carmen Not to mention that it's a violation of the Usenet COC to pose as another user, using their id. He can lose his ISP newsgroup privileges in a heartbeat for doing this. SignaturePeter http://users.thelink.net/marengo > I know. You said that's the reason you don't have a gun. So, you would > sooner be unarmed than kill someone who is attacking you? It still makes > no sense to me, but it doesn't have to make sense to me, if it makes > sense to you, that's all that counts. :-) > -- I'm not the poster to whom you're directing this question, but I was raised in a house *full* of guns and I have chosen not to have any despite having been burglarized more than once. My reasoning is that I spook easily. Any bump in the night would mean that I would need to have that gun in my hand. The risk of shooting a housemate, spouse, or child in a blind panic is too great, and the possiblilty that my house will be broken into while I and my kids are in it just isn't *as* great. There's also the fact that as I grew up I knew of more than one kid at my jr high school who got daddy's gun and showed it to their friend with the all-to-predictable result. I'm not willing to gamble that my kids are smarter than that. The final reason is that my dad had some guns stolen, probably by friends of my (at the time, she's grown up well in spite of her earlier troubles) delinquent step-sister. Everyone knew my dad had a cache of weapons, and that's just a whole 'nother level of socially irresponsible. All the while I will defend the right to bear arms - and by "bear arms" I *do* mean have access to the same weaponry that the military does. How else can we hope to "defend ourselves against tyranny"? brigid >I know. You said that's the reason you don't have a gun. So, you would >sooner be unarmed than kill someone who is attacking you? It still makes >no sense to me, but it doesn't have to make sense to me, if it makes >sense to you, that's all that counts. :-) Cheri what if i mistook my husband for a burgler. I had a very bad dream one night where I thought a stranger was in my room. My husband is a musician and comes in at all hours. Anyway I was having a bad dream to begin with when he walked into the room to kiss me on my cheek. So I scrambled to the other side of the bed more or less screaming when he finally got me to wake up. If I had a gun I might not have tried to run away from him, I'm sure i would've shot him. I canb't trust myself to shoot only the bad guys. besides my beagles raise holy hell if anyone comes near the house. they smell them long before they get very close. Patti Hey, I'm 100% for the right to bear arms, or not to bear them, as a person chooses. -- Cheri >what if i mistook my husband for a burgler. I had a very bad dream one >night where I thought a stranger was in my room. My husband is a [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > >Patti One final thought. The beagles wake you up so you'll be alert while you're being attacked? Or do you pummel the intruder dog biscuits? Just kidding. Take care, and I hope none of us have to go through what Luna did. -- Cheri Cheri wrote in message ... >>besides my beagles raise holy hell if anyone comes near the house. >>they smell them long before they get very close. >> >>Patti >One final thought. The beagles wake you up so you'll be alert while >you're being attacked? Or do you pummel the intruder dog biscuits? Just >kidding. Take care, and I hope none of us have to go through what Luna >did. hehehe, the beagles are on LC so I'd have to pummel them with pig feet :) Patti |
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