Weight Loss Forum / Low Carb / July 2005
Good News About Keeping it Off!
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Martha Gallagher - 26 Jul 2005 20:07 GMT Sometimes we get so bombarded w/ messages saying that losing weight is difficult (it is) and keeping it off can be worse (true) that we lose sight of the fact that it can be done.
A recent article in the Washington Post (you can probably find the same study in other articles) describes an update from the National Weight Loss Registry. <http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/07/25/ AR2005072501203.html>
While, as most of us here know, the NWLR has a bit of a bias against low carb dieters, there are lessons to be taken from this.
The most important is that, yes, people can lose significant percentages of their starting body weight and maintain the loss. Even better, the longer you maintain the loss, the more likely you are to continue to maintain it. One of the most important factors seems to be incorporating daily physical activity.
Interestingly, half of the successful maintainers weighed every day while 30% did so once a week. My own experience bears this out. When I thought I'd gotten to the point that I could maintain w/out having to keep weighing, I gained 5 lbs. It came off pretty easily, but it was a reminder that we need to keep one eye on objective measurements.
Eating breakfast is also key. While most of us would disagree w/ their recommendations of what to have for breakfast, there is solid evidence that having something that keeps you going through the morning is helpful. Or, at least 80% of the participants found it to be so.
Perhaps the most important thing is being able to make a recovery if you do start to slip back. It's easy to find that as we start to relax our vigilence our weight starts nudging back up. But, it's also easy, once we notice that, to say, "right, starting *now* I'm back on track".
Martha, who will have been lowcarbing 3 years come August.
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Roger Zoul - 26 Jul 2005 20:39 GMT I disagree that keeping weight off is worse than losing it. I think that's only true for people won't don't do it, for whatever reason. I believe that once you get it off, it's easy to keep it off if you do the right thing!
I think the main thing that enables one to keep weight off long term is to simply keep your focus on your weight. If you do that, then daily activity, and/or attention to diet & weight will enable one to maintain. IMO, the good thing about activity, though, it that it helps one be more aware of one's body. If you're active, then even gaining a couple of pounds becomes very noticable because you feel those pounds as you try to move. Watching the scale should do that for people who don't enjoy being active.
Bottom line (IMO): if you lose your focus on weight you lose your weight loss.
:: Sometimes we get so bombarded w/ messages saying that losing weight :: is difficult (it is) and keeping it off can be worse (true) that we [quoted text clipped - 38 lines] :: -- :: Sig pending Marsha - 26 Jul 2005 23:33 GMT > I disagree that keeping weight off is worse than losing it. I think that's > only true for people won't don't do it, for whatever reason. I believe that > once you get it off, it's easy to keep it off if you do the right thing! I'll let you know when I've been at goal for a while ; )
Marsha/Ohio
Luna - 26 Jul 2005 23:56 GMT > I disagree that keeping weight off is worse than losing it. I think that's > only true for people won't don't do it, for whatever reason. I believe that [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > Bottom line (IMO): if you lose your focus on weight you lose your weight > loss. I think that's what makes it hard, having to maintain focus on your weight for the rest of your life. I know I never want to go back to eating the way I used to, but I also would not like to have to think about my food and my weight so much.
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Marsha - 27 Jul 2005 00:11 GMT > I think that's what makes it hard, having to maintain focus on your > weight for the rest of your life. I know I never want to go back to > eating the way I used to, but I also would not like to have to think > about my food and my weight so much. Luna, Your new haircut is very flattering. Totally changes your face.
Marsha/Ohio
Luna - 27 Jul 2005 01:35 GMT > > I think that's what makes it hard, having to maintain focus on your > > weight for the rest of your life. I know I never want to go back to [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > Marsha/Ohio Thanks. It's actually different again now, that pic isn't actually new anymore. I'll get new pics up one of these aeons.
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Saffire - 27 Jul 2005 02:24 GMT *** This post originated in alt.support.diet.low-carb -- it's appearance in any other forum is deceptive and unauthorized. ***
> Luna, > Your new haircut is very flattering. Totally > changes your face. Yeah, it's really cute and a good style for you! (I thought it looked cute before, too :-)
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Susan - 27 Jul 2005 00:11 GMT > I think that's what makes it hard, having to maintain focus on your > weight for the rest of your life. I know I never want to go back to > eating the way I used to, but I also would not like to have to think > about my food and my weight so much. That's just the way it is, though. I recall seeing a study of folks who'd lost substantial amounts of weight and kept it off. They had to plan their eating and pay attention to do it.
Susan
Luna - 27 Jul 2005 01:38 GMT > x-no-archive: yes > [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > Susan I suppose we're really arguing a difference in semantics here. I have to pay attention to my gas gauge in my car, to make sure I don't run out, but I'd hardly say I'm "focused" on it. I have to make sure I brush my teeth consistently, to make sure they don't rot out of my head, but then again I'm not focused on my teeth. I know I will have to be conscientious about my food intake and working out for the rest of my life if I want to stay healthy, but I don't want my life to revolve around it as the focus.
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Roger Zoul - 27 Jul 2005 02:03 GMT :> In article <3knu9fFv31n1U1@individual.net>, :> Susan <nevermind@nomail.com> wrote: [quoted text clipped - 22 lines] :> for the rest of my life if I want to stay healthy, but I don't want :> my life to revolve around it as the focus. Why do you seem to make being conscientious about food intake and working out such a major issue above all of the other things you do? Do you really think it takes an all-consuming, 24/7 focus on maintaining to achieve it? Why isn't it simply eating the right foods for you, getting in whatever exercise you enjoy on a regular basis, and watching your weight on some regular interval? Why it is any more involved than that?
You look at your gas gauge everyday, you brush your teeth every day, you eat every day. There are other things that you do consistently that you don't have to do everyday. Exercise can fit into that catagory. Getting on the scale or thinking about how your clothes fit is another.
Martha Gallagher - 27 Jul 2005 02:04 GMT > > x-no-archive: yes > > [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > life if I want to stay healthy, but I don't want my life to revolve > around it as the focus. Actually, in the original article, that's the way they described it - like remembering to brush everyday. And, for me, that analogy works particularly well - I used not to be good about dental care (I did brush regularly but flossing was a sometimes thing and I frankly avoided cleanings). After a run in w/ periodontal disease (and one very expensive titanium implant later) I got religion wrt oral care. Now I'm very conscientious about brushing, flossing and checkups. But, except when I'm doing those things, I don't think about oral hygiene particularly. If someone brought up implants, then I'd tell them about my experience, but otherwise it's not a thing in my life. Same w/ food, I had a problem that got me into some bad ways, I took control of the problem, when I'm making food decisions I take the problem into account, if someone mentions that they have the problem I'll tell them about my experience, but other than that it's not the focus of my life.
But, I will tell you all about the cute things my nephews did. <g>
Martha
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Susan - 27 Jul 2005 03:11 GMT > I suppose we're really arguing a difference in semantics here. I have > to pay attention to my gas gauge in my car, to make sure I don't run [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > life if I want to stay healthy, but I don't want my life to revolve > around it as the focus. That sounds about right to me, so why focus on it? Why not just incorporate it?
Susan
Cubit - 27 Jul 2005 20:11 GMT I'll take except to your ideas here, Luna.
Humans have a regulatory process for calories. So, not paying attention to diet is like relying on a car's cruise control that has been shown to malfunction in the past.
In the new haircut picture your face is very cute now, but I guess I don't understand women's hair styles. I guess it is a sign of my age.
> In article <3knu9fFv31n1U1@individual.net>,
> I suppose we're really arguing a difference in semantics here. I have > to pay attention to my gas gauge in my car, to make sure I don't run [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > life if I want to stay healthy, but I don't want my life to revolve > around it as the focus. Martha Gallagher - 27 Jul 2005 00:28 GMT > > I disagree that keeping weight off is worse than losing it. I think that's > > only true for people won't don't do it, for whatever reason. I believe that [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > eating the way I used to, but I also would not like to have to think > about my food and my weight so much. Just to clarify a bit, I said that maintaining "can be" harder than losing not "is".
Nevertheless, the statistics do seem to bear that out. Of all the people who lose significant amounts of weight, how many keep it off for several years? Some, and that's what the article is about, but it does seem that many people find it easier to lose the weight than to maintain the loss.
I consider myself one of the successful losers. I've maintained a 60lb loss for over 2.5 years. Some times have been harder than others, but I've never had more than a day or two off plan and getting back on plan has never been a struggle. My BMI is in the normal range, I'm wearing size 6-10 clothes (what can I say, the sizing of women's clothes is variable). My BF% is still higher than I'd like, but since my measurements are going down, I think that that is changing in the right direction
I know what you mean about wishing you could get down to a place where you're "done" and not think about it any more, but it just doesn't work that way. And, given the foods we have available to us, it doesn't seem too burdensome to me. I found knowing the tricks of other successful dieters was helpful to me, it validated that my habits are likely to lead to continued success and reminded me of things I hadn't really thought of. Also, the numerical progression that the longer you keep it off the more likely you are to stay on track is reassuring.
Martha
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Roger Zoul - 27 Jul 2005 01:17 GMT >>>I disagree that keeping weight off is worse than losing it. I think that's >>>only true for people won't don't do it, for whatever reason. I believe that [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] > years? Some, and that's what the article is about, but it does seem that > many people find it easier to lose the weight than to maintain the loss. IMO, many people simply revert back to old habits and don't even try to maintain the loss. They think it will happen by "magic".
IOW, the data isn't tracking how hard it is to keep weight off, it just says that folks quit trying. Two very different things, IMO.
I personally think it is very important to make the point...because if we keep telling ourselves that maintaining loss is so "hard" to do, we'll simply give up. I don't find it hard to maintain my 142 lb loss and I'm not special. I simply wish to keep it off and I make it a priority.
> I consider myself one of the successful losers. I've maintained a 60lb > loss for over 2.5 years. Some times have been harder than others, but I've [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > My BF% is still higher than I'd like, but since my measurements are going > down, I think that that is changing in the right direction Those who try, like you, do. Those who don't, regain.
> I know what you mean about wishing you could get down to a place where > you're "done" and not think about it any more, but it just doesn't work [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > Martha Saffire - 27 Jul 2005 02:29 GMT > IMO, many people simply revert back to old habits and don't even try to > maintain the loss. They think it will happen by "magic". That's what *I* always thought before I went low-carb. I did a LOT of magical thinking :-)
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Roger Zoul - 27 Jul 2005 00:54 GMT :> In article <11ed4b7mmk9n0ea@news.supernews.com>, :> "Roger Zoul" <rogerzoul2@hotmail.com> wrote: [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] :> eating the way I used to, but I also would not like to have to think :> about my food and my weight so much. Interesting. Funny that many maintain a focus on going to work everday for years, raising kids, taking care of parents, paying insurance, doing yardwork, pursuing hobbies. IMO, people seem to have no problem maintain a focus over long periods of time, on things that are important to them. So, if maintaining a focus on weight is hard, it must be because it's not important.
Luna - 27 Jul 2005 01:35 GMT > :> In article <11ed4b7mmk9n0ea@news.supernews.com>, > :> "Roger Zoul" <rogerzoul2@hotmail.com> wrote: [quoted text clipped - 27 lines] > if maintaining a focus on weight is hard, it must be because it's not > important. I suppose for me it's because focusing on my weight feels like focusing on my appearance, and the other things you list are more important than appearance. I know it's about health too, but it just seems so self-centered. And there is also the danger of being _too_ focussed, which is also a danger in all the things you listed above as well. I mean, don't you get sick of talking to someone whose main topic of conversation is what they ate that day and how much they worked out? I don't want to be one of those people. Nor do I want to bore people to death with minutiae about my job, or the cute things my nephews do, or my finances.
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Roger Zoul - 27 Jul 2005 01:55 GMT :> In article <11edj62nngvj5f6@news.supernews.com>, :> "Roger Zoul" <rogerzoul2@hotmail.com> wrote: [quoted text clipped - 39 lines] :> I suppose for me it's because focusing on my weight feels like :> focusing on my appearance, and the other things you list are more important
:> than appearance. Appearance is important, too.
:> I know it's about health too, but it just seems so :> self-centered. You get one body and one life (so I'm told).
:> And there is also the danger of being _too_ focussed, :> which is also a danger in all the things you listed above as well. :> I :> mean, don't you get sick of talking to someone whose main topic of :> conversation is what they ate that day and how much they worked out? Sure. But you don't have to talk about that stuff. Showing up in here is one way to keep focus. If you find an activity you enjoy for exercise, go find a newgroup to feed that focus or read about it, or train to improve, or whatever. Many ways....
:> I don't want to be one of those people. Nor do I want to bore :> people to :> death with minutiae about my job, or the cute things my nephews do, :> or :> my finances. Interesting that you seem to equate maintaining a focus to talking people to death on a subject. Not necessary.
Cubit - 27 Jul 2005 20:28 GMT > :> In article <11ed4b7mmk9n0ea@news.supernews.com>, > :> "Roger Zoul" <rogerzoul2@hotmail.com> wrote:
> Interesting. Funny that many maintain a focus on going to work everday for > years, raising kids, taking care of parents, paying insurance, doing > yardwork, pursuing hobbies. IMO, people seem to have no problem maintain a > focus over long periods of time, on things that are important to them. Point:
> So, > if maintaining a focus on weight is hard, it must be because it's not > important. Counterpoint: Nonsense. Through most of human history calorie regulation had to happen naturally without conscious control or intervention. Dieting, as we know it is unnatural. Dieting actually triggers a counter response by the regulator, which some call an "appestat." The regulatory process is supposed to fool us. I have observed that it acts very slowly. The influence it exerts today is based on calories from weeks ago. It is nothing like paying insurance.
Doug Freyburger - 27 Jul 2005 21:08 GMT > > So, > > if maintaining a focus on weight is hard, it must be because it's not > > important. It does seem like an apt definition for what has long term importance and what does not.
> Counterpoint: > Nonsense. Through most of human history calorie regulation had to happen > naturally without conscious control or intervention. Through most of human history the mechanism in place was lack of excess food. During hunter-gatherer times for the majority of humanity's existance excess food was a rarity but lack of food was anywhere from common through unusual. During most of the existance of agriculture (under 20K yrs) it's been boom and bust. Only in the last few centuries has excess food in quantity been available year-round year in and year out for numerous people.
> Dieting, as we know it > is unnatural. Dieting actually triggers a counter response by the > regulator, which some call an "appestat." The regulatory process is > supposed to fool us. I have observed that it acts very slowly. The > influence it exerts today is based on calories from weeks ago. It is > nothing like paying insurance. It's a reaction to starvation.
Part of what I harp on constantly is avoiding this starvation mechanism. There's a carb-driven starvation mechanism involving leptin and seratonin that makes keeping carbs too low a starvation trigger. Fat and protein also have trigger mechanisms.
Cubit - 28 Jul 2005 13:53 GMT > > > So, > > > if maintaining a focus on weight is hard, it must be because it's not [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > quantity been available year-round year in and year out for > numerous people. Hunter Gatherer studies I read about suggested that they needed just a few hours per day to sustain themselves. There was lots of leisure time.
> > Dieting, as we know it > > is unnatural. Dieting actually triggers a counter response by the [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > starvation trigger. Fat and protein also have trigger > mechanisms. A starvation response from a lack of carbs? I don't think so. I've never seen or read serious evidence of that. With a shortage of fat, protein, or calories, yes, one could expect a starvation response. However, as far as I know, a shortage of carbs is only suspect with respect to nutrients, such as folates or potassium, which may be low. This effect may be attributable to our current practice of avoiding organ meats, which are very nutritious.
Doug Freyburger - 28 Jul 2005 16:02 GMT > > Through most of human history the mechanism in place was lack > > of excess food. During hunter-gatherer times for the majority [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > Hunter Gatherer studies I read about suggested that they needed just a few > hours per day to sustain themselves. There was lots of leisure time. Then again spending more time trying to gather food produces rapidly dimminishing returns in a hunter-gatherer society. The supply of food is both non-time-consuming and limited. Thinking about that, it sounds like humans are very well evolved for a hunter-gatherer society. Humans gather what food is available in a short amount of time and have plenty left over for social interaction. Yet spending more and more time on more and more gathering fails to increase the supply much. It took the conceptual revolutions of animal herding and agriculture to break out of that very effective model.
> > Part of what I harp on constantly is avoiding this starvation > > mechanism. There's a carb-driven starvation mechanism involving [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > A starvation response from a lack of carbs? I don't think so. I've never > seen or read serious evidence of that. There's a stream of folks who remain on Induction and stall. Be at a fixed level of calories eaten and loss, then time goes on and the exact same level of carbs eaten and no loss, that's a metabolic change that I don't mind calling a starvation mode. Especially when it can be broken out of by increasing carbs and moving towards the Atkins-CCLL.
> With a shortage of fat, protein, or > calories, yes, one could expect a starvation response. However, as far as > I know, a shortage of carbs is only suspect with respect to nutrients, such > as folates or potassium, which may be low. Studies of very low carb intake show that T3 output falls. Stone age societies that eat very lcose to zero carb for long periods of time (the few Inuits who still live the tradional hunting lifestyle) aren't in ketosis and don't lose. Some metabolic change needs to happen within them to drop them out of ketosis and examples like Admundson cited by Atkins show that change can happen to anyone so it isn't a genetic uniqueness of Inuits. Wether you will call this a starvation mode response is a matter of tastes, but going from losing to not losing at the same total calories is the primary way I define a stavation response.
There's also the fact that most people desire carbs. A lot of people who extend Induction feel deprived of carbs. It makes extended Induction a crash and burn fad diet risk when viewed as the only-or-best way to lose vs an educated decision knowing that higher carb intake doesn't decrease loss rates. Is the deprived feeling purely cultural or is there a physical driver working in the hormones somehow? I don't know the answer but I do know what happens when someone who's stayed at 20 too long starts to eat higher carb foods.
> This effect may be attributable > to our current practice of avoiding organ meats, which are very nutritious. Knowing the nutritious nature I am puzzled at the avoidance. Knowing the history behind it I wonder when the stimga that poor people are stuck eating liver because the rich folks took the flesh will fade out of our culture.
Cubit - 29 Jul 2005 01:07 GMT I have a hunch that a form of imprinting occurs with respect to food during childhood. Maintaining a new way-of-life diet of any kind as an adult may be very abnormal.
> > > Through most of human history the mechanism in place was lack > > > of excess food. During hunter-gatherer times for the majority [quoted text clipped - 71 lines] > poor people are stuck eating liver because the rich folks > took the flesh will fade out of our culture. RRzVRR - 27 Jul 2005 14:31 GMT > While, as most of us here know, the NWLR has a bit of a bias against low > carb dieters, there are lessons to be taken from this. I just sent back my recent NWLR survey; like every time before a large notation is made on the form stating that my weight lost was due to low carb eating.
> The most important is that, yes, people can lose significant percentages > of their starting body weight and maintain the loss. Even better, the > longer you maintain the loss, the more likely you are to continue to > maintain it. One of the most important factors seems to be incorporating > daily physical activity. As someone who's lost over 100lbs TWICE I can relay that my experience was that losing is easier than maintaining -- and -- that my regain the first time was at least 50% due to a drop in my daily exercise routine. While your losing you're highly focused and fairly consistently rewarded with change (mirror, size, scale, improved fitness, ect.). Once at goal its just been fitness changes that keep my going.
My first 100lb lost was via low-fat and a good deal of cardio with moderate/regular WT. This last 100lbs loss was via LC (which has been easier and more enjoyable) along with some cardio and a greater emphasis in WT. So far so good. In July 2000 I was at my lowest LC weight (around a 120-125lb loss). I started LC 1/98. Since then I have gone up and down in manageable amounts due to training/injury and other factors. But sticking with LC has enabled me to not gain back my excessive BF.
In short, this time around I'm much more aware that I'll never be free from having to focus on about my eating and fitness habits.
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Roger Zoul - 27 Jul 2005 15:09 GMT :: Martha Gallagher wrote: ::: [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] :: size, scale, improved fitness, ect.). Once at goal its just been :: fitness changes that keep my going. What about appearance and being able to exercise well?
:: My first 100lb lost was via low-fat and a good deal of cardio :: with moderate/regular WT. This last 100lbs loss was via LC [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] :: due to training/injury and other factors. But sticking with LC :: has enabled me to not gain back my excessive BF. Yeah, if you're doing LF and you quit exercising...it's truly just a matter of time for complete weight regain. Carbs with no exercise will make most formerly fat people get fat again, probably due to their state of being metabolically screwed in the first place!
I think that with LC, a formerly fat person could stop exercising altogether and maintain weight just fine, as long as they keep that focus on maintaining weight. I don't, of course, recommend doing it, but i'm confident that I could with ease.
:: In short, this time around I'm much more aware that I'll never be :: free from having to focus on about my eating and fitness habits. Yeah, same here.
JC Der Koenig - 27 Jul 2005 15:41 GMT > I think that with LC, a formerly fat person could stop exercising > altogether and maintain weight just fine, as long as they keep that focus > on maintaining weight. I don't, of course, recommend doing it, but i'm > confident that I could with ease. First you have to become a formerly fat person to find out.
Not much chance of that.
RRzVRR - 28 Jul 2005 12:44 GMT > What about appearance and being able to exercise well? Those are rewards along with the physiological reactions to exercise that offer stress relief. But there's not the large rush of pride and gratification experienced when first experiencing tangible rewards the efforts made -- and experiencing those rewards repeatedly over months. Each change in size or fitness was often substantial (or at least easily measurable) and a direct reward for the efforts made. When the changes are imperceptible the perceived reward is faint. The "proof" of the efforts aren't as obvious or sometimes even measurable. It becomes difficult to validate your efforts. Additionally I think its easy to develop a appetite to that experience of that "rush" from the reward.
For example: I got a big thrill and felt a huge rush of pride the first day I ran a solid mile, the first time I loaded 45s on the bar to bench press, passing then 50lbs/100lbs lost, etc. Those thrills are a huge incentive to keep working hard. The 54th time I ran 3 miles there's wasn't the thrill or sense of accomplishment experienced on first time. I stopped running for many reasons after the marathon, but one was that it started to become boring, and that I'm sure that was impart to the lack of perceived changes. I keep WTing impart because the changes are more measurable and offer me more validation.
> :: My first 100lb lost was via low-fat and a good deal of cardio > :: with moderate/regular WT. This last 100lbs loss was via LC [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > formerly fat people get fat again, probably due to their state of being > metabolically screwed in the first place! I here you, yet I do believe that if I had keep up my exercise habits the regain might not have happened to the degree that it did. You could Google the whole story, but in brief I lost a job that had an on-site gym. Out of work, no gym and falling in love with my husband all at the same time PLUS the whole low-fat eating were all factors to the regain. But one thing that was a big psychology factor in my regain was the mental mindset that I had permanently CHANGED. Since I had lost so much weight and managed to keep it off for over 2 years (the period in which most people regain their weight -- a stat that I was well aware of) my belief was that I had ~changed~ and that I was a normal person. If I had kept the point of view that my body was always going to require my focus. It didn't matter if it was 2 years of 2 decades my body would always want to store BF, then I might not have back-slided.
> I think that with LC, a formerly fat person could stop exercising altogether > and maintain weight just fine, as long as they keep that focus on > maintaining weight. I don't, of course, recommend doing it, but i'm > confident that I could with ease. Unfortunately I'm living the experiment on that right now. Long story short, my right shoulder and neck have been a major problem for me over the last 6 weeks. I've not been able to do my regular workout routine and because of the pain have not wanted to workout myself at all. Initially my intake dropped without much thought. Then over time, the restriction of calories was a very conscience decision. However, in the last two weeks I've been having some real problems due to not training, plus vacationing with my husband, and then having a friend come stay with us and experience NYC for the first time. Add to that drinking more than usual.
At first my drop in calories was easy and very much an eye opener. I could see how my WTing had a physical and psychological impact on my intake. When you know you've moved 25-35,000 pounds its easy to need to take in more food. But probably not to the degree I mentally believed that my body needed.
After a couple of weeks, it was only slightly harder to stick to plan. But now the mix of vacation activities along with a feeling very down about not being able to work out has made it hard to stick to plan. Not being able to work out and get the stress relief and enjoyment from training, leads to feeling depressed, leads to making poor eating choices, leads to a physical change (I don't want to venture a guess how much my BF% has increased these last 6 weeks), leads to see myself different, and on, and on. Starting Friday when my guest has left and I have started working with my clients again at the gym will be a break the in cycle. I'll get in some cardio and go some leg training and hopefully shake out my mindset.
> :: In short, this time around I'm much more aware that I'll never be > :: free from having to focus on about my eating and fitness habits. > > Yeah, same here. Got to tell you to just be careful and don't get hurt. Having to break from your regular fitness routine can really through a wrench in your plans. A lot of people don't understand how much training can be apart of your life. Aside from the fact that I'm a trainer, I enjoy and need the challenge of training. I could go on, but you get the idea.
Take care.
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Roger Zoul - 28 Jul 2005 20:34 GMT :: Roger Zoul wrote: ::: RRzVRR wrote: [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] :: its easy to develop a appetite to that experience of that "rush" :: from the reward. Interesting...I've heard this many times before. However, I've always had a hard time feeling good about losing weight for the simple reason that I had gained it in the first place. It's like I've always been fighting just to get to the starting line, not to mention actually starting the race. Hence, I don't see the the getting smaller as much of a reward in and of itself, but I do see *being smaller* as a big payoff and reward. Hence, everyday I keep the weight off is another reward. :) Like you, I once lost 100 lbs on LF and regained everybit of it and more. The second time I lost big weight, it was via LC....this time, it will stay off because I don't allow myself to regain it.
:: For example: I got a big thrill and felt a huge rush of pride the :: first day I ran a solid mile, the first time I loaded 45s on the :: bar to bench press, passing then 50lbs/100lbs lost, etc. Those :: thrills are a huge incentive to keep working hard. The 54th time :: I ran 3 miles there's wasn't the thrill or sense of :: accomplishment experienced on first time. Time to start a new activity, right?
I stopped running for
:: many reasons after the marathon, but one was that it started to :: become boring, and that I'm sure that was impart to the lack of :: perceived changes. I keep WTing impart because the changes are :: more measurable and offer me more validation. Take up bike racing! :)
::::: My first 100lb lost was via low-fat and a good deal of cardio ::::: with moderate/regular WT. This last 100lbs loss was via LC [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] :: habits the regain might not have happened to the degree that it :: did. I do think it helps. I think one reason for that is that when you exercise consistently, you are always more aware of your body....hence, weight gain become more noticable and bothersome.
:: You could Google the whole story, but in brief I lost a job :: that had an on-site gym. Out of work, no gym and falling in love :: with my husband all at the same time PLUS the whole low-fat :: eating were all factors to the regain. Sounds just like what happened tome....
:: But one thing that was a :: big psychology factor in my regain was the mental mindset that I [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] :: decades my body would always want to store BF, then I might not :: have back-slided. Yeah...there is a superfat version of me that is waiting in the wings to take center stage. Who's it gonna be...me or him?
::: I think that with LC, a formerly fat person could stop exercising ::: altogether and maintain weight just fine, as long as they keep that [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] :: with us and experience NYC for the first time. Add to that :: drinking more than usual. Yep..those things can do it. Time to redouble your focus...start visualizing.
:: At first my drop in calories was easy and very much an eye :: opener. I could see how my WTing had a physical and [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] :: the in cycle. I'll get in some cardio and go some leg training :: and hopefully shake out my mindset. Yep....remember, it's easier to lose 10 lbs than 50!
::::: In short, this time around I'm much more aware that I'll never be ::::: free from having to focus on about my eating and fitness habits. [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] :: a trainer, I enjoy and need the challenge of training. I could :: go on, but you get the idea. Absolutely. It happened to me the first time around and was part of my demise. Frankly, when I was doing LF, I made exercise a huge part of the plan by doing shitloads of it everyday. Being heavy in the first place made it easy to drop pounds while still eating a lot of food (LF food). Once I got hurt (my feet) the exercise stopped. Then other life issues started...and it all boiled up.
:: Take care. :: [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] :: Check out the a.s.d.l-c FAQ at: :: http://www.grossweb.com/asdlc/faq.htm RRzVRR - 29 Jul 2005 11:06 GMT > :: Roger Zoul wrote: > ::: RRzVRR wrote: [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] > it was via LC....this time, it will stay off because I don't allow myself to > regain it. I've gone up a little from time to time, but I won't regain back to the point before. That was far too painful an experience.
> :: For example: I got a big thrill and felt a huge rush of pride the > :: first day I ran a solid mile, the first time I loaded 45s on the [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > Time to start a new activity, right? I've always sort of rotated my challenges. Sometime a stronger focus a particular WT move, sometimes a stronger focus on a particular cardio exercise.
> I stopped running for > :: many reasons after the marathon, but one was that it started to [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > Take up bike racing! :) I do consider that as an option from time to time.
> ::::: My first 100lb lost was via low-fat and a good deal of cardio > ::::: with moderate/regular WT. This last 100lbs loss was via LC [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > consistently, you are always more aware of your body....hence, weight gain > become more noticable and bothersome. Agreed.
> :: You could Google the whole story, but in brief I lost a job > :: that had an on-site gym. Out of work, no gym and falling in love [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > Yeah...there is a superfat version of me that is waiting in the wings to > take center stage. Who's it gonna be...me or him? I tend to look at it like a long card game... genetics deals the hand and I play them. Sometimes the hand includes injuries, sometimes its an easy win.
> ::: I think that with LC, a formerly fat person could stop exercising > ::: altogether and maintain weight just fine, as long as they keep that [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > Yep..those things can do it. Time to redouble your focus...start > visualizing. Right, I'm going to have to try and stop missing WT routine and regretting my current situation and find another focus for the time being.
> :: At first my drop in calories was easy and very much an eye > :: opener. I could see how my WTing had a physical and [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > > Yep....remember, it's easier to lose 10 lbs than 50! Honestly I miss the training even more than I worry about the weight. Its a large part of my life that's gone.
> ::::: In short, this time around I'm much more aware that I'll never be > ::::: free from having to focus on about my eating and fitness habits. [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > got hurt (my feet) the exercise stopped. Then other life issues > started...and it all boiled up. I have an MRI today and hopefully an answer soon so I'll know exactly what I'm going to be dealing with. Things will get easier to handle after a plan to deal with the situation is in place.
> :: -- > :: Rudy - Remove the Z from my address to respond. [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > :: Check out the a.s.d.l-c FAQ at: > :: http://www.grossweb.com/asdlc/faq.htm
 Signature Rudy - Remove the Z from my address to respond.
"It is better to die on your feet than to live on your knees!" -Emiliano Zapata
Check out the a.s.d.l-c FAQ at: http://www.grossweb.com/asdlc/faq.htm
Nicky - 29 Jul 2005 21:29 GMT > I have an MRI today and hopefully an answer soon so I'll know exactly what > I'm going to be dealing with. Things will get easier to handle after a > plan to deal with the situation is in place. Here's hoping it's something straightforward.
Nicky.
 Signature A1c 10.5/5.6/<6 T2 DX 05/2004 1g Metformin, 100ug Thyroxine 95/76/72Kg
Jenny - 28 Jul 2005 14:09 GMT > Sometimes we get so bombarded w/ messages saying that losing weight is > difficult (it is) and keeping it off can be worse (true) that we lose [quoted text clipped - 32 lines] > > Martha, who will have been lowcarbing 3 years come August. These points match my own experience exactly except for the part about exercise. I've found that getting on the scale every morning is a key factor in my own weight maintenance. Without that discipline it is very easy to gain 3 or 4 lbs without noticing it.
Since I have diabetes, I also find that testing my blood sugar after any carby meal is also required for good control. Seeing a number over my blood sugar target takes most of the fun out of eating things I shouldn't. Not so coincidentally, controlling my blood sugar does a lot to control my weight--no matter what diet I am eating.
I do periodically gain a couple pounds and just as often I get them back off. It's a lot easier to lose 3 lbs than 25.
I'm heading into the end of year 3 since my second major weight loss and I weighed 144 today, one pound under my goal. This is 26 lbs under what I weighed 7 years ago when I started this process.
I can't do a lot in the way of exercise due to back problems (to which have been added foot nerve damage problems.) Oddly enough, I am having a much easier time maintaining my weight without exercise thanks to metformin, a diabetes drug that controls insulin resistance, than I had when I was doing an hour of vigorous exercise almost every day for a year. My cholesterol rations are much prettier too.
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