 |
 | Home | Contact Us | FAQ | Search & Site Map | Link to Us |
 | Sign In | Join | Other 45 Sites in Network |
| HomeDiscussion GroupsGeneral TopicsLow CarbWeightWatchers WeightAdviser.com Contact UsLink To UsSearch & Site Map |
Weight Loss Forum / Low Carb / November 2008"net" carbs?
Is it true that you shouldn't count fiber and sugar alcohol carbs? This seems a little fishy to me...why is it these things don't count? How can you still eat a lot of fiber and still enter ketosis? >Is it true that you shouldn't count fiber and sugar alcohol carbs? >This seems a little fishy to me...why is it these things don't count? >How can you still eat a lot of fiber and still enter ketosis? Everyone in my personal circle of friends and family that has started playing the net carb game has either stopped losing weight, or gaining weight. My personal belief is that the whole thing was invented to create a market of high-carb tasting, low-net-carb foods to sell. That being said, some people believe in it. > In message <24fc0$4907eb3c$d064c25a$22...@news.eurofeeds.com> rabbits77 > <rabbit...@my-deja.com> was claimed to have wrote: [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > > That being said, some people believe in it. People believe in it because there is science and lots of experience behind it. Fiber does not get digested like a simple sugar or starch carb would. Insoluble fiber does not get digested at all and passes throught the digestive system. Soluble fiber winds up being fermented in the digestive tract and turned into short chain fatty acids, which are then absorbed and processed by the body, but not as carbs. And there is science that these short chain fatty acids have beneficial side effects. One of those is to lower cholesterol, which is why adding soluble fiber to the diet either through foods or supplements is recommended as one way of lowering cholesterol. Sugar alcohols are a different subject. They do get digested and absorbed to some extent like carbs would. However, their impact on blood glucose levels varies widely, depending on the particular SA. Some have a relatively small impact on BG, hence they can be discounted from the total carb impact. If you google this group, you'll find plenty of discussion on the pros/cons of SA, deducting them, etc. IMO, if you're doing say Atkins, beyond induction, losing OK, not having cravings, etc, eating proper amounts of other food, then including them in moderation and deducting them from the carb count is OK. On the other hand, if you're having problems and consuming them with abandon, making them a main component of your diet, thinking they are totally 0 carb, then that's another thing. Also, depending on the SA and the person, many people can have digestive issues with them if they eat more than a small amount at a time. "trad...@optonline.net" <trad...@optonline.net> wrote: > .... Fiber does not get digested like a simple sugar or starch > carb would. Insoluble fiber does not get digested at all and passes > throught the digestive system. Dig through the carb counts and suggestions in the early editions of the Atkins book and you might conclude that Dr A considered deducting insoluble fiber from the gate. There are inaccuracies in various counts that could just be that or that could just be demonstration of just how inaccurate counts really are. Anyways, I think the reason insoluble fiber isn't counted separately is US labels just list fiber without separating them by type. Even if you decide to use total carb counts there's no effect by deducting insoluble fiber if you find the count for it. > Soluble fiber winds up being > fermented in the digestive tract and turned into short chain fatty [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > is why adding soluble fiber to the diet either through foods or > supplements is recommended as one way of lowering cholesterol. That's why soluble fiber deduction makes sense if you're counting carb grams. If you're counting calories the soluble fiber doesn't get deducted from calorie counts just from carb counts. > Sugar alcohols are a different subject. They do get digested and > absorbed to some extent like carbs would. This is why I chose to may the conservative personal choice to not accept deduction for sugar alcohols, glycerine, effective digested carbs or any similar claims. I also encourage folks to look at monetary incentives that the claims have before accepting such claims. Consider the difference between counting and deducting with a sugar alcohol candy or gum or whatever. With counting it cuts into my total food for the day by reducing my portions of root veggies or whatever. With deducting I'm adding something like candy to my existing food. With quantites as small as a daily stick of sugar free gum the amount is too small to matter in most cases. But it does not take much for it to add up fast. > However, their impact on > blood glucose levels varies widely, depending on the particular SA. That's the basis for almost all such claims. The problem with it is the description applies just as well to the carbs in cauliflower and I do count the carbs in cauliflower. If I am to have a consistent count I would need to ignore cauliflower and all other similar low carb veggies. > Some have a relatively small impact on BG, hence they can be > discounted from the total carb impact. If you google this group, [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > then including them in moderation and deducting them from the carb > count is OK. Exactly. My caution is that proper amounts of food needs to end up taking the sugar alcohols and such into account. It is very easy to forget to do that if you're deducting. > On the other hand, if you're having problems and > consuming them with abandon, making them a main component of your > diet, thinking they are totally 0 carb, then that's another thing. It's also a problem if you're using them as a crutch to keep intact an old bad habit of eating the wrong food. There's a big difference between eating a bite a couple of times per week that gets counted against your daily food, and a daily snack that doesn't. > Is it true that you shouldn't count fiber and sugar alcohol carbs? There's a lot of discussion on that. > This seems a little fishy to me... Good. Be cautious about what claims you do or don't accept. > why is it these things don't count? Sometimes there's good science behind it. Other times there plentiful money behind a claim. Learn how to tell which. > How can you still eat a lot of fiber and still enter ketosis? That's really the keystone here. If you're using Atkins and using ketonuria to find your CCLL then you want to be deliberately in ketonuriawhile you are losing and deliberately out of ketonuria once you have already lost. In that sense it really resolves all issues about carb counts - When using ketonuria all the carb counts really do is teach you what type of day to day intake you want. The counts become your way of telling if you're going to stay in ketonuria losing or not (setting aside agruments that loss happens with or without ketonuria). Your ketonuria will teach you whether the deductions are tur for you or not and the real answer isn't whether the deductions work for everyone (they don't) but whether the deductions work for *you*. Learning by experiment on yourself beats all of the discussion in the world. So that's what I suggest - Find your CCLL using total carbs by increasing until you spent a week out of ketonuria. Then you know 5-10 under that count will put you in ketonuria. Then see what your counts would be with fiber deduction. The actual food won't be any different just the count because what matters is the ketonuria not the count. Then try it using sugar alcohols and see if you fall out of ketonuria. Because what matters is the ketonuria not the count staying in or falling out will teach you how your body reacts to sugar alcohols better than all the studies and claims in the world. And if you're on a plan that doesn't use ketonuria? Then the issue doesn't matter except if eating the sugar alcohols stop your loss. >> Is it true that you shouldn't count fiber and sugar alcohol carbs? > [quoted text clipped - 39 lines] > issue doesn't matter except if eating the sugar alcohols stop > your loss. That makes perfect sense. I am not measuring ketonuria but I have in the past. I basically know at this point how I feel when my body switches over into ketosis. I am no doing Atkins but rather following a Cyclical Ketogenic Diet as described by Lyle McDonald in his books. Here is an amazon.com link if anyone is interested. http://tinyurl.com/5vqtao I have been eating a decent amount of peanuts and pistachios but they are both high in fiber and so far it seems like the fiber is not effecting ketosis. I agree with other posters in this thread and don't really really consume much, if any, sugar alcohols. It sn't that I fear the carbs but mainly I just don't like sweets to begin with so don't miss them. Indeed, I am mainly on this diet not for weight loss but because I think that my body doesn't seem to handle starches very well. I believe, but have not proven, that my body overreacts to starch consumption. I feel extremely lethargic and get bloated if I eat a fairly normal diet. I discovered this diet through my interest in weight lifting. Many competetive body builders use this diet. I do CKD instead of a fully ketogenic diet because I think that while my body does not handle carbs well they are still necessary for proper health so I consume them 1-2 days per week. > Is it true that you shouldn't count fiber and sugar alcohol carbs? > This seems a little fishy to me...why is it these things don't count? > How can you still eat a lot of fiber and still enter ketosis? hiiiiiiiiiiiiiican u help me >> Is it true that you shouldn't count fiber and sugar alcohol carbs? >> This seems a little fishy to me...why is it these things don't count? >> How can you still eat a lot of fiber and still enter ketosis? > > hiiiiiiiiiiiiiican u help me Probably not.  SignatureSteve > Is it true that you shouldn't count fiber and sugar alcohol carbs? > This seems a little fishy to me...why is it these things don't count? > How can you still eat a lot of fiber and still enter ketosis? Fiber is indigestible. |
Reply to this Message |
 Sign In
 Join
 My Latest Posts My Monitored Threads My Blog My Photo Gallery My Profile My Homepage Start New Thread Enable EMail Alerts Rate this Thread
|
©2012 Advenet LLC Privacy Policy - Terms of Use
This website includes both content owned or controlled by Advenet as well as content owned or controlled by third parties.