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Weight Loss Forum / Low Carb / March 2004Speaking of frankenfood
In my mind, the link between saturated fat and heart disease is a tenuous connection, but they keep doing things to lower saturated fat content: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/4527120/ What if what they do is worse than what came before?  SignatureBob in CT Remove ".x" to reply > In my mind, the link between saturated fat and heart disease is a tenuous > connection, but they keep doing things to lower saturated fat content: > > http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/4527120/ > > What if what they do is worse than what came before? Well, I nothing wrong at all with feeding cows a reasonable diet that could change composition of fat in milk. It seems like a commercial project by a large dairy producer, it will give them more sales, and it is unlikely to harm anyone. i :: In article <opr4wvprzkrjctj4@news.snet.sbcglobal.net>, Bob in CT :: wrote: [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] :: project by a large dairy producer, it will give them more sales, and :: it is unlikely to harm anyone. Beside the fat that it is of dubious value and places blame where it needn't be. Naturally, you'd see nothing wrong with that. >:: In article <opr4wvprzkrjctj4@news.snet.sbcglobal.net>, Bob in CT >:: wrote: [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > Beside the fat that it is of dubious value and places blame where it needn't > be. Naturally, you'd see nothing wrong with that. I am not sure how feeding cows various seeds is going to make milkfat more dubious. I presented no opinion as to whether saturated fat is bad. i :: In article <105bonk5kuk4qc2@corp.supernews.com>, Roger Zoul wrote: ::: Ignoramus21819 wrote: [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] :: I am not sure how feeding cows various seeds is going to make milkfat :: more dubious. Milkfat won't be dubious...I'm suggesting that lowering/removing the it's sat fat content is... :: I presented no opinion as to whether saturated fat is bad. Why do something if it has no value? Just for the freakin hell of it? :: i >:: In article <105bonk5kuk4qc2@corp.supernews.com>, Roger Zoul wrote: >::: Ignoramus21819 wrote: [quoted text clipped - 22 lines] > Milkfat won't be dubious...I'm suggesting that lowering/removing the it's > sat fat content is... Well, if it happens because they add some seeds to cows' diet, I think it is unlikely to lead to anything bad. Seeds are not the worst thing that is fed to cows. >:: I presented no opinion as to whether saturated fat is bad. > > Why do something if it has no value? Just for the freakin hell of it? All I was saying Roger, quite plainly, is that I saw nothing wrong with what that company was doing. You are weaseling here, somehow trying to prove that I implied that saturated fat is bad, whereas I have no opinion on that. Why? The company was trying to make milk that was lower in saturated fat, by means that do not seem in any way harmful to me, in order to sell more milk (duh). What's your problem here. i :: In article <105bsje8ihksdee@corp.supernews.com>, Roger Zoul wrote: ::: Ignoramus21819 wrote: [quoted text clipped - 28 lines] :: think it is unlikely to lead to anything bad. Seeds are not the worst :: thing that is fed to cows. I think it does lead to something bad -- furthering the misinformation that sat fat is bad...I don't have a problem with feeding seeds to cows...that is probably better than feeding them corn... ::::: I presented no opinion as to whether saturated fat is bad. ::: [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] :: All I was saying Roger, quite plainly, is that I saw nothing wrong :: with what that company was doing. And I do... :: You are weaseling here, somehow trying to prove that I implied that :: saturated fat is bad, whereas I have no opinion on that. Why? I'm not trying to prove anything.....but you said you see nothing wrong with it, and I'm saying I do. :: The company was trying to make milk that was lower in saturated fat, :: by means that do not seem in any way harmful to me, in order to sell :: more milk (duh). Well, they already remove fat from milk...and that has not done much in terms of improving the health of the overall population.....and if there is less fat, even if it's composition is the same, less of it will have less impact....and it is not clear that altering the content of the fat in cow's milk won't have other unanticipated results on those who consume cow's milk. Doing things like this just to to lower the amount of sat fat so you can sell more stuff, imo, is really a waste of time. :: What's your problem here. What's your problem -- you see nothing wrong it -- I do. Get over it. Bob, In my researches lately, I've seen some very good research that shows that saturated fat and glucose spells death for your pancreas' beta cells. Unsat fats and poly's are okay. But the only way you can eat sat fats without harm appears to be by keeping to the ketogenic levels of carb intake. Once you are eating enough carb to raise blood sugar the combo with sat fat is really, truly dangerous. The connection with heart disease may be that high blood sugars cause thickening of artery walls in not only large but small arteries and capillaries. That's why people with diabetes get eye damage and kidney damage. The fat seems to be part of the biochemical process, but when mixed with the high blood sugar. -- Jenny - Low Carbing for 4 years. At goal for weight. Type 2 diabetes, hba1c 5.2. Cut the carbs to respond to my email address! Low carb facts and figures, my weight-loss photos, tips, recipes, strategies for dealing with diabetes and more at http://www.geocities.com/jenny_the_bean/ Looking for help controlling your blood sugar? Visit http://www.alt-support-diabetes.org/Newly%20Diagnosed.htm > In my mind, the link between saturated fat and heart disease is a tenuous > connection, but they keep doing things to lower saturated fat content: [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > Bob in CT > Remove ".x" to reply :: Bob, :: :: In my researches lately, I've seen some very good research that :: shows that saturated fat and glucose spells death for your pancreas' :: beta cells. This sounds geared toward diabetics....also, does this apply when total calorie intake doesn't exceed maintenance? I suggest that the damning law of excess still applies.... :: Unsat fats and poly's are okay. But the only way you :: can eat sat fats without harm appears to be by keeping to the :: ketogenic levels of carb intake. Again, is this true as long as calories are not in excess? :: Once you are eating enough carb to :: raise blood sugar the combo with sat fat is really, truly dangerous. So, is this a problem mainly for diabetics are does it apply to anyone? :: The connection with heart disease may be that high blood sugars cause :: thickening of artery walls in not only large but small arteries and :: capillaries. That's why people with diabetes get eye damage and :: kidney damage. The fat seems to be part of the biochemical process, :: but when mixed with the high blood sugar. that last sentence seems imcomplete. Was there more? :: -- :: Jenny - Low Carbing for 4 years. At goal for weight. Type 2 [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] ::: Bob in CT ::: Remove ".x" to reply Roger, The stuff I'm finding applies to anyone who isn't rock solid normal--as in blood sugars that don't rise much over 90 mg/dl ever. Very few people reading this newsgroup are likely to be in that category.The ADA defines normal as up to 140 mg/dl. But there is a ton of research published in medical journals you can read on the web that shows that damage to body systems starts at blood sugar levels that are much lower than the ADA "normal." In fact, you can develop serious nerve pain and heart disease at levels lower than normal. Cast an eye on this brand new study that shows beta cell deterioration beginning when blood sugar levels on an Oral Glucose Tolerance test are over 100 mg/dl at 2 hrs. http://tinyurl.com/2wv27 It isn't calories, it's how high your blood sugar rises over true normal which is under 90 mg/dl and how long it stays elevated. The excess blood sugar floating around your body after meals causes all kinds of subtle changes in cells, and when that excess blood sugar combines with sat fat it is very bad for you. Among other things, it starts killing your beta cells making your blood sugar go higher. A very low carb diet will keep most people who have slight blood sugar abnormalities below 90 mg/dl, but not everyone. And just a little "treat" can push it back up again, too, well above 120 mg/dl at 2 hrs, even if you low carb most of the time It's worth looking at your 2-hr post meal blood sugars to see what they look like every now and then. -- Jenny - Low Carbing for 4 years. At goal for weight. Type 2 diabetes, hba1c 5.2. Cut the carbs to respond to my email address! Low carb facts and figures, my weight-loss photos, tips, recipes, strategies for dealing with diabetes and more at http://www.geocities.com/jenny_the_bean/ Looking for help controlling your blood sugar? Visit http://www.alt-support-diabetes.org/Newly%20Diagnosed.htm > :: Bob, > :: [quoted text clipped - 49 lines] > ::: Bob in CT > ::: Remove ".x" to reply Can you tell me the name of that article...the url doesn't work for some reason...thanks. :: Roger, :: [quoted text clipped - 97 lines] :::::: Bob in CT :::::: Remove ".x" to reply Stupid medscape medline interface. Here's the pub med version: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=pubmed&dopt=Ab stract&list_uids=14666364 http://tinyurl.com/2orto -- Jenny - Low Carbing for 4 years. At goal for weight. Type 2 diabetes, hba1c 5.2. Cut the carbs to respond to my email address! Low carb facts and figures, my weight-loss photos, tips, recipes, strategies for dealing with diabetes and more at http://www.geocities.com/jenny_the_bean/ Looking for help controlling your blood sugar? Visit http://www.alt-support-diabetes.org/Newly%20Diagnosed.htm > Roger, > [quoted text clipped - 92 lines] > > ::: Bob in CT > > ::: Remove ".x" to reply > Roger, > [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > > http://tinyurl.com/2wv27 the link dos not work. Can you perhaps post pubmed ids? i |
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