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Weight Loss Forum / WeightWatchers / February 2005

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A 'Nutritional Meal in a Glass'

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Gareth - 14 Feb 2005 16:15 GMT
Hello Folks,

I was introduced to something called Herbalife about 6 months ago as a
business opportunity.  I thought that the main Herbalife product was just
another slimming drink  I'm a sceptical person by nature and didn't take it
too seriously.  I'm not a salesman, so I can't just SELL products.  I wanted
to find something that I believe in and distribute it.

Being slim, I didn't need to lose any weight.  I wasn't getting the
nutrition that I needed on a mostly vegetarian diet.  What I did need to do
is supplement my nutrition and gain some energy.  I had become very
lethargic.  So after much procrastination, I met up with some distributors,
met some product users (in fact most distibutors are also product users) and
tried the products for myself.

Imagine the scenario.  I am the worlds worst cook.  I hate cooking, full
stop.  Somebody hands me a carton and says "You can mix this with some
half-fat milk and you have a nutritional meal."  I'm in heaven.  Two days
afer starting my program I was full of energy.  I found myself running up
the stairs, something that I hadn't done for a while.

So this is a weight-watchers newsgroup.  Most people want to LOSE weight,
why am I talking about GAINING weight?  This is the point.  What I want to
reach, the same as most of the readers of this group, is my IDEAL weight ...
and then stay there.

I've recently met many people from the other end of the spectrum, those who
are overweight.  Each person has a story to tell.  But what tells the
clearest stories, are their 'before and after' photographs.  A picture
really does paint a thousand words.

So what about this Herbalife 'stuff'?  As the name suggests, Herbalife
products are created from totally natural herbal ingredients and produced in
an ethical manner (this is important issue for me).  The best selling
product is called Formula 1 and is, as I mentioned, a meal in a glass.  This
has all the nutrients of a good healthy meal.  Formula 1 can be supplemented
with Protein powder.  The amount is tailored to your desired BMI (Body Mass
Index).  This is why it can be used for losing, gaining OR maintaining
weight.  People on a weight-loss program usually have two shakes per day
(normally replacing breakfast and lunch) with a healthy meal for dinner.
The protein powder consists of Soy protein (for building muscle fibres) and
whey protein.  It's the whey protein that keeps the hunger pangs away.
Although some people do use our snack products between meals.

For me, maintaining my weight and energy level (!) I have 1 shake per day,
usually at lunchtime.  I can't say enough about this.  Apart from feeding
your body, it also feeds your mind.  I am far more alert than I was before
using Herbalife products.  And the taste.  These drinks taste great
(Vanilla, Chocolate, Strawberry, Tropical Fruit, Cappuccino).  How can
something that tastes so good be so good.  One pack normally lasts 3 - 4
weeks (depending on your intake of course) and works out at less than the
cost of a sandwich per day.  A nutritious meal for the price of a cheese
sandwich.

But enough from me for now.  I'm not going to push, but if you really want
to manage your weight, all the information that you need is below.  But
before I go, ask yourself "Why did so many product users become
distributors?".  The answer is, because they totally believe in what they
use, and they want to share it.

Take a look at www.herbalife.com and select Shapeworks to see the
weight-management programs.
Also take a look at
http://www.havealook.org/1234/retail_warm/default.asp?distid=07197882 for
some testimonials.
If you want to give me a call you can do so on 07986 344413.
I'm in Britain, if you live across and ocean and don't want to phone me, you
can email me on gareth.herbalife@ntlworld.com
If you are thinking about buying some of these amazing products but are
worrying about delivery from Britain, don't.  We are in 60 countries and
will despatch your order from your nearest point.

Thanks for reading, and good luck.
Gareth
Willow - 14 Feb 2005 17:22 GMT
That's a lot of writting for something nobody will read...

Keep on keeping on !

Signature

Will~

196.2 / 131.8 / 137 lbs
89 / 59.8 / 62.1 Kg

Personal goal 125 lbs / 56.7 Kg

> Hello Folks,
>
[quoted text clipped - 70 lines]
> Thanks for reading, and good luck.
> Gareth
Gareth - 15 Feb 2005 11:57 GMT
It's so easy to post to a hundred newsgroups with a URL for something that
you know nothing about but just want to make money from.  I could have done
that but I supplied you with some genuine information regarding something
that I believe in.  You can either take it or leave it.  If you are happy
with your weight and couldn't care less about people who have changed their
lives, that's entirely up to you.  You must be so content.

Gareth

> That's a lot of writting for something nobody will read...
>
[quoted text clipped - 94 lines]
> > Thanks for reading, and good luck.
> > Gareth
nck - 15 Feb 2005 14:20 GMT
On 2/15/05 5:57 AM, in article pslQd.76$e03.46@newsfe2-win.ntli.net,

> It's so easy to post to a hundred newsgroups with a URL for something that
> you know nothing about but just want to make money from.  I could have done
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
>
> Gareth
Oh my, aren't we righteously offended, though.
Naff off, Gareth.  That stuff is garbage and you know darn well it's garbage
and you are out to make a buck ( or a quid)
Gareth - 15 Feb 2005 15:49 GMT
Dear dear, we are a sensitive lot aren't we.

Look, there are many ways to 'make a quick buck' & I can assure you that
this isn't one of them.

I'm not ramming anything down anyone's throat, I was simply offerring the
choice to select a product with which many people have had success.  If you
don't want to use it, then don't.  Move on.

I cannot imagine offering this information in a paper advertisement and
receiving so much hassle.  What is it about this newsgroup anyway, why so
much hostility?  I've read so much here about people whining about their
weight and I offer what I believe is a solution ... and I would not offer
something that I think is 'garbage'.  I have seen great results from many
people who are now very happy with their weight.  If you want to continue
rotting here in self-pity that's up to you.

> On 2/15/05 5:57 AM, in article pslQd.76$e03.46@newsfe2-win.ntli.net,
>
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
> Naff off, Gareth.  That stuff is garbage and you know darn well it's garbage
> and you are out to make a buck ( or a quid)
ray miller - 15 Feb 2005 17:50 GMT
>I've read so much here about people whining about their
>weight and I offer what I believe is a solution

OK - you've done the research and you think it's a solution to weight
loss. You post the peer reviewed articles that support your
proposition and I'll look at them - till then you are a spammer

Ray

Signature

2002 1.8i eternal red

Lynne - 15 Feb 2005 18:36 GMT
Does your ISP know about your 'helpful' information? You're smart
enough to word your message in such a way to not look like a sales
pitch. A rose by any other name...

Lynne
Highest Weight - 308
WW Start Weight this time around Dec 29/04 - 222.4
Weight this week - 215.6
Goal - 150 (Subject to change)
"Change doesn't happen while you're sitting around."

>Dear dear, we are a sensitive lot aren't we.
>
[quoted text clipped - 32 lines]
>garbage
>> and you are out to make a buck ( or a quid)
ray miller - 14 Feb 2005 17:53 GMT
>I'm not a salesman

...but i'm trying very hard to become one...

Ray

Signature

2002 1.8i eternal red

Gareth - 15 Feb 2005 11:49 GMT
I gave you a lot of information there Ray, rather than just hit you with a
website and lots of blah blah.  If I was ONLY concerned with making money,
there are many other unethical ways to do so.  If you don't want the
information I supplied, that's your choice.  You keep your head up your @rse
and keep on plodding on.

Gareth

> >I'm not a salesman
>
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> --
> 2002 1.8i eternal red
Anna H. - 15 Feb 2005 14:02 GMT
>I gave you a lot of information there Ray, rather than just hit you with a
>website and lots of blah blah.  If I was ONLY concerned with making money,
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
>
>Gareth

This snake oil has been discredited by so many consumer programs and
prosecuted so many times by Trading Standards, I'm amazed it's still
going. It's like acne - you think it's eradicated and then you have a
bad month and it pops up again.

If you were really concerned with ethics, you'd support people losing
weight healthily and sensibly, not selling them expensive junk.
Signature

Anna (in UK)
Start Weight: 174 lbs
Goal Weight: 146 lbs
Current Weight: 163 lbs

Gareth - 15 Feb 2005 16:01 GMT
Anna,

So you've had personal experience with Herbalife products ... or snake oil
as you prefer to call it?

I'm interested to hear more regarding the Consumer Programs and Trading
Standards.  Why this reaction to the products?  Can products that adhere to
laws in 60 countries Worldwide really be so bad?

Do you really consider a healthy shake for the price of a can of 'bubbly
brown sugar water' to be expensive?

This is the first non-personal, sensible response I've had to the post in
this group.  I've done a lot of research, but I'd be curious to hear more.

> >I gave you a lot of information there Ray, rather than just hit you with a
> >website and lots of blah blah.  If I was ONLY concerned with making money,
[quoted text clipped - 16 lines]
> Goal Weight: 146 lbs
> Current Weight: 163 lbs
Anna H. - 15 Feb 2005 18:33 GMT
Gareth,
>So you've had personal experience with Herbalife products ... or snake oil
>as you prefer to call it?

If I had and it was a bad experience, and said so, I could get sued for
libel, regardless of the truth of the matter. If I hadn't, and said
something negative, I could still get sued as there's no such thing as
free speech for the little guy.

Haven't you read about the "McLibel" case? Couple of people criticised a
certain fast food company and got sued, but under UK law they received
no legal aid so were unable to defend themselves properly. The fast food
company, OTOH, had millions and were able to employ the best. They won
but the bigger "victory" (and bigger injustice) was caused by their
ability to keep the case running for over a decade, thus destroying the
lives of their "victims".

The supposed victims have now successfully sued the UK government for
denial of free speech, but they're never going to get back the 15 odd
years they've wasted fighting this case.

I know of a similar case regarding a person who criticised a famous pet
store brand.

So I'm afraid I'm not going to answer your questions, and anyone with
any sense is not going to answer your questions.

>I'm interested to hear more regarding the Consumer Programs and Trading
>Standards.  Why this reaction to the products?  Can products that adhere to
>laws in 60 countries Worldwide really be so bad?

Tobacco's sold in more countries, perfectly legally.

>Do you really consider a healthy shake for the price of a can of 'bubbly
>brown sugar water' to be expensive?

I'd dispute your use of the word "healthy".

>This is the first non-personal, sensible response I've had to the post in
>this group.  I've done a lot of research, but I'd be curious to hear more.

Researching such a thing is well-nigh impossible, since very few people
would be prepared to risk a libel suit to state their true opinions.

All of the major search engines rank sites not just according to
relevance, but also according to who is paying them to be ranked. There
are suggestions they omit sites that may be deleterious to their
sponsors. Search engines are not independent.

What I can suggest is that you ask your employer for the scientific
evidence on which they base their claims - *independent* scientific
evidence. I could be mistaken, but you will probably find there isn't
any. Anecdotal evidence does not count as there is a strong placebo
effect with anything like this.

Your employer are a Multi-level Marketing Company (MLM). This is similar
to a pyramid scheme in that the big boss sells to the middle guy, who
sells to the smaller guy, who sells to everyone he knows. The only
difference is that with a pyramid scheme, there is no actual product and
with an MLM there is a product. Pyramid schemes are illegal in UK, which
is possibly why Trading Standards and the various consumer shows may
have investigated.

MLM schemes are legal in UK, and most other parts of the world, but are
they wise?

Here's a few links:
MLM Watch, Herbalife section:
http://www.mlmwatch.org/04C/Herbalife/herbalife00.html
http://www.mlmwatch.org/04C/Herbalife/herbalife04.html

Rick Ross Institute's articles on Herbalife.
http://www.rickross.com/groups/herbalife.html

"10 Big Lies of MLM":
http://www.mlmwatch.org/01General/10lies.html

"Multilevel Marketing of Health Products":
http://www.ncahf.org/pp/mlm.html

MLM Survivors site:
http://www.mlmsurvivor.com/

Appropriate Use of Dietary Supplements:
http://www.quackwatch.org/03HealthPromotion/supplements.html

I can recommend the Quackwatch site for other medical/health related
things.

Disclaimer: All of these links state the opinions of others re.
Herbalife and are not necessarily my opinion.

I am posting them in reply to your question just in case you are
genuine. FYI, this is a newsgroup for people following the Weight
Watchers program or interested in the WW's program.
Signature

Anna (in UK)
Start Weight: 174 lbs
Goal Weight: 146 lbs
Current Weight: 163 lbs

wafflycat - 15 Feb 2005 16:29 GMT
> This snake oil has been discredited by so many consumer programs and
> prosecuted so many times by Trading Standards, I'm amazed it's still
> going. It's like acne - you think it's eradicated and then you have a bad
> month and it pops up again.

Is Gareth's little product the one which Sam Fox was involved in with Peter
Foster years ago, which was *massively* discredited on national media over
here in the UK?

> If you were really concerned with ethics, you'd support people losing
> weight healthily and sensibly, not selling them expensive junk.

Quite. A spammer is a spammer. I've killfiled him.
Anna H. - 16 Feb 2005 12:26 GMT
Hi Waffley,
>> This snake oil has been discredited by so many consumer programs and
>> prosecuted so many times by Trading Standards, I'm amazed it's still
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
>Foster years ago, which was *massively* discredited on national media over
>here in the UK?

No, that was a kind of tea. This product is a total meal replacement
system ie. Kind of along the same lines as Slimfast, only you replace
*every* meal with a drink, not just two meals a day. It is extremely low
calorie, compensated for, the makers claim, by the fact that it contains
a lot of vitamins and minerals.

Do you remember the "Cambridge Diet" from a few years ago? That was a
similar type of system, except that was even lower calorie: 400-500
calories per day. That's what I mean about these systems being as
pervasive as acne.

They do use a total meal replacement system in some obesity clinics -
usually for people who are going to die unless they lose weight fast,
but in general it's not considered a good idea - there are major health
concerns about very low calorie diets of any kind, plus these "diets"
don't actually retrain the eating habits that got you into obesity in
the first place. So such diets could be actively encouraging yo-yo'ing,
rather than being a way of life, because as soon as you go back to real
food, you could over-eat. Depriving yourself has never been a good
strategy for modifying any behaviour - sooner or later, you'll rebel and
then it's even harder to get back OP. We know how hard it is doing a
sensible program like WWs - but at least we can eat proper food!
Signature

Anna (in UK)
Start Weight: 174 lbs
Goal Weight: 146 lbs
Current Weight: 163 lbs

"The revolutionary new diet pill that turns body fat into Rolex watches" -
Dilbert Online

wafflycat - 16 Feb 2005 12:48 GMT
> Hi Waffley,
>>> This snake oil has been discredited by so many consumer programs and
[quoted text clipped - 13 lines]
> calorie, compensated for, the makers claim, by the fact that it contains a
> lot of vitamins and minerals.

Indeed it was.  I *loathe* "diets" that are meal replacement and/or rely on
a lot of pre-prepared stuff you are expected to buy. Successful weight loss
over the long term and then keeping it off really means a person *needs* to
understand about healthy eating and be able to produce healthy meals for
themselves. The meal replacement things are the spawn of satan as far as I'm
concerned ;-) All they teach is reliance on processed food.

> Do you remember the "Cambridge Diet" from a few years ago? That was a
> similar type of system, except that was even lower calorie: 400-500
> calories per day. That's what I mean about these systems being as
> pervasive as acne.

No doubt it'll resurface at some time or other.

Cheers, helen s
ray miller - 16 Feb 2005 18:18 GMT
>They do use a total meal replacement system in some obesity clinics -
>usually for people who are going to die unless they lose weight fast,
>but in general it's not considered a good idea - there are major health
>concerns about very low calorie diets of any kind, plus these "diets"
>don't actually retrain the eating habits that got you into obesity in
>the first place.

AIUI the diets used in obesity clinics are virtually all protein, and
nothing like herbalife. They are also carried out under medical
supervision.

Interestingly not only is it contraversial for weight loss it also
uses MLM techniques which are also contraversial.
http://www.mlmwatch.org/04C/Herbalife/niteworks.html

and a lawsuit
http://www.rickross.com/reference/herbalife/herbalife_lawsuit.html

and a review
http://www.thedietchannel.com/Herbalife-diet.htm

real life experiences
http://personalpages.tds.net/~richbirr/herbalife.htm

ray

Signature

2002 1.8i eternal red

ray miller - 15 Feb 2005 17:47 GMT
>I gave you a lot of information there Ray, rather than just hit you with a
>website and lots of blah blah.  If I was ONLY concerned with making money,
>there are many other unethical ways to do so.  If you don't want the
>information I supplied, that's your choice.  You keep your head up your @rse
>and keep on plodding on.

Not interested in your views spammer

Ray

Signature

2002 1.8i eternal red

Gareth - 15 Feb 2005 18:20 GMT
If you're not interested in other views Ray, you should set up another
newsgroup called alt.ray.alone and post messages to yourself, then you will
always find someone who agrees with you ... or then again, maybe not.

spammer

n : someone who sends unwanted email (often in bulk)

I get genuine spam every day and either block it or delete it.  This was ...
initially ... a very relevant topic that I posted to all of, hmmm, 4 groups.
It's really so easy. if you don't want to read, then don't.

'The Spammer'

> >I gave you a lot of information there Ray, rather than just hit you with a
> >website and lots of blah blah.  If I was ONLY concerned with making money,
[quoted text clipped - 8 lines]
> --
> 2002 1.8i eternal red
Laura - 15 Feb 2005 18:47 GMT
The majority of the members of this newsgroup have decided that the
appropriate way of losing weight is to change their eating habits and not
rely of quick fixes in the form of pills or shakes. Your message is unwanted
and a waste your your time and energy. It is SPAM!

Go away spammer.

Or do we have to report you to your ISP's abuse desk?

> spammer
>
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
>
> 'The Spammer'
Willow - 15 Feb 2005 22:48 GMT
I just love it when someone spams, try to make it look like they don't.. and
then get pissed when they are being told that they do..

This guy takes it even further tho.. pursuing it and posting again.. "From
spam to trolling in half a lesson"

That'd make a good book or something..
Signature

Will~

196.2 / 131.8 / 137 lbs
89 / 59.8 / 62.1 Kg

Personal goal 125 lbs / 56.7 Kg

> The majority of the members of this newsgroup have decided that the
> appropriate way of losing weight is to change their eating habits and not
[quoted text clipped - 16 lines]
> >
> > 'The Spammer'
Laura - 15 Feb 2005 23:14 GMT
Spammers are clueless and so are trolls. ;-)

> I just love it when someone spams, try to make it look like they don't.. and
> then get pissed when they are being told that they do..
[quoted text clipped - 24 lines]
> > >
> > > 'The Spammer'
Gareth - 16 Feb 2005 01:00 GMT
I'm sat here in amazement.  This 'discussion' left the realms of reality a
long time ago.

It was never the intention to sell you a miracle cure that you could drink
and wake up the next morning your desired weight.  I was offering a meal
supplement while you diet slowly and sensibly, using products that I have
learned about, not created.  If you are not interested, don't read.  If you
see information in a paper or shop-window that you don't like, do you phone
the number and insult them?  No, because facing people in real life is
harder for some, whereas this newsgroup seems to be a place to vent your
frustration.

I'm hiding nothing from my ISP.  Hey, I supplied so much information I all
but beat a path to my front door.  If it makes you little newsgroup police
officers feel better about yourself, go ahead and report the post, you will
find that most offensive material came from you lot.  The only constructive
response that I have had is from Anna H., which led me to do more research.
The rest of you couldn't manage more than a couple of lines of name-calling.
Call yourself adults?

I wish I could say that it's been fun but, well, I'm still shaking my head
in disbelief.  As Willow informed me earlier, this is a waste of my time and
energy and I really do have better things to do.

So I'll leave you all in your tight little group to wallow in self-pity and
whine some more.

Bye bye.

> Spammers are clueless and so are trolls. ;-)
>
[quoted text clipped - 36 lines]
> > > >
> > > > 'The Spammer'
nck - 16 Feb 2005 03:49 GMT
On 2/15/05 7:00 PM, in article 8XwQd.61$or.13@newsfe4-gui.ntli.net, "Gareth"
<gareth.news@ntlworld.com> wrote:

> I'm sat here in amazement.  This 'discussion' left the realms of reality a
> long time ago.
You are in serious need of some basic English classes.
Willow - 16 Feb 2005 06:28 GMT
I learned a new word this week, "sticktoitiveness" you're a pro !

Signature

Will~

196.2 / 131.8 / 137 lbs
89 / 59.8 / 62.1 Kg

Personal goal 125 lbs / 56.7 Kg

> I'm sat here in amazement.  This 'discussion' left the realms of reality a
> long time ago.
[quoted text clipped - 66 lines]
> > > > >
> > > > > 'The Spammer'
nck - 17 Feb 2005 05:32 GMT
On 2/15/05 7:00 PM, in article 8XwQd.61$or.13@newsfe4-gui.ntli.net, "Gareth"
<gareth.news@ntlworld.com> wrote:

> So I'll leave you all in your tight little group to wallow in self-pity and
> whine some more.
>
> Bye bye.
Don't let the door hit you on the way out.
Willow - 17 Feb 2005 05:54 GMT
Self pity ? and there I felt bad for bragging all the time ! ;op

Signature

Will~

196.2 / 131.8 / 137 lbs
89 / 59.8 / 62.1 Kg

Personal goal 125 lbs / 56.7 Kg

> On 2/15/05 7:00 PM, in article 8XwQd.61$or.13@newsfe4-gui.ntli.net, "Gareth"
> <gareth.news@ntlworld.com> wrote:
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> > Bye bye.
> Don't let the door hit you on the way out.
Amberle3 - 16 Feb 2005 01:04 GMT
You might want to review the Terms and Conditions you have with your ISP.
This is straight from the TOS:

E. You will not:
11. send or provide any unsolicited advertising or other promotional
material, commonly referred to as "spam" by email, webmail or by any other
electronic means;

This is advertising, it is unsolicited, and it has been sent by electronic
means.  Therefore it is SPAM.  And yes, it has been reported to your ISP.

Signature

Amberle3
249/230/210-minigoal/150?
Renewed my commitment to me 3/30/03

- Generic Exercise Challenge: http://www.angelfire.com/me4/travelgirl/ge.htm
   November 29-February 27
- It's Never Too Late Weight Loss Challenge:
http://www.angelfire.com/me4/travelgirl/intl.htm
   December 6-February 27
- Weight Loss Challenge Summary:
http://www.angelfire.com/me4/travelgirl/summary.htm

> If you're not interested in other views Ray, you should set up another
> newsgroup called alt.ray.alone and post messages to yourself, then you
[quoted text clipped - 28 lines]
>> --
>> 2002 1.8i eternal red
Willow - 15 Feb 2005 18:41 GMT
Woooaaa quite a saleman..

Signature

Will~

196.2 / 131.8 / 137 lbs
89 / 59.8 / 62.1 Kg

Personal goal 125 lbs / 56.7 Kg

> I gave you a lot of information there Ray, rather than just hit you with a
> website and lots of blah blah.  If I was ONLY concerned with making money,
[quoted text clipped - 12 lines]
> > --
> > 2002 1.8i eternal red
Anna H. - 15 Feb 2005 19:05 GMT
>Woooaaa quite a saleman..

My friend said the words "We are Borg. You will be assimilated" popped
into her mind when she read the original post. Funny that.
Signature

Anna (in UK)
Start Weight: 174 lbs
Goal Weight: 146 lbs
Current Weight: 163 lbs

"The revolutionary new diet pill that turns body fat into Rolex watches" -
Dilbert Online

Willow - 15 Feb 2005 22:46 GMT
*grin*

Signature

Will~

196.2 / 131.8 / 137 lbs
89 / 59.8 / 62.1 Kg

Personal goal 125 lbs / 56.7 Kg

> >Woooaaa quite a saleman..
> >
> My friend said the words "We are Borg. You will be assimilated" popped
> into her mind when she read the original post. Funny that.
Lipgloss Junkie - 16 Feb 2005 06:59 GMT
This has been a fun thread to read...at the orginal poster's expense.

If that guy had spent any amount of time (and had 1/2 a brain) he would
have anticipated the reaction he got. Geez. The last thing any of us
needs is some meal-in-a -glass. Who wants to drink their points? Not
me.

There's no magic bullet. And I refuse to spend any more time or money
trying to find it.

Melanie
ray miller - 16 Feb 2005 12:05 GMT
>This has been a fun thread to read...at the orginal poster's expense.
>
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
>There's no magic bullet. And I refuse to spend any more time or money
>trying to find it.

Well said :)

Ray

Signature

2002 1.8i eternal red

Laura - 16 Feb 2005 18:01 GMT
> This has been a fun thread to read...at the orginal poster's expense.
>
> If that guy had spent any amount of time (and had 1/2 a brain) he would
> have anticipated the reaction he got. Geez. The last thing any of us
> needs is some meal-in-a -glass. Who wants to drink their points? Not
> me.

Your last comment reminds me about the time mom asked me if I stopped
drinking. I was never really a drinker to begin with so it was very easy to
give up the 5pm glass of wine (or 2) with her *every day* that she enjoys so
much. My response was that I'd rather EAT my points than DRINK it. I'm not
sure if she understood or not.

> There's no magic bullet. And I refuse to spend any more time or money
> trying to find it.

Well said. WW is working just fine on normal food.
Brian - 16 Feb 2005 19:31 GMT
Okay, so that's abuse at ntlworld.com, abuse at virgin.net, also also abuse
at hotchilli.com (the host of havealook.org, which is allowing its members
to spam and doesn't have a registered abuse address). Not to mention the
spam and viruses the poster will get for posting with a real email address.
Don't forget to include the headers as I have pasted them below.

As you tried to explain, you think spam is only bulk messages. There is also
UCE, which is unsolicited commercial postings. So this is still spam and I'm
sure those who are providing your services will not take well to it.

Path:
border1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!border1.nntp.ams.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.co
m!npeer.de.kpn-eurorings.net!feed.news.schlund.de!schlund.de!newsfeed01.sul.
t-online.de!t-online.de!news-in.ntli.net!newsrout1-win.ntli.net!ntli.net!new
speer1-win.ntli.net!newsfe1-gui.ntli.net.POSTED!53ab2750!not-for-mail
From: "Gareth" <gareth.news@ntlworld.com>
Newsgroups: alt.support.diet.weightwatchers
Subject: A 'Nutritional Meal in a Glass'
Lines: 78
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000
Message-ID: <z84Qd.608$9w5.82@newsfe1-gui.ntli.net>
Date: Mon, 14 Feb 2005 16:15:27 GMT
NNTP-Posting-Host: 82.12.250.138
X-Complaints-To: abuse@virgin.net
X-Trace: newsfe1-gui.ntli.net 1108397727 82.12.250.138 (Mon, 14 Feb 2005
16:15:27 GMT)
NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 14 Feb 2005 16:15:27 GMT
Organization: Virgin Net Usenet Service
Xref: number1.nntp.dca.giganews.com alt.support.diet.weightwatchers:277287
> Hello Folks,
>
[quoted text clipped - 70 lines]
> Thanks for reading, and good luck.
> Gareth
usenet69@hotmail.com - 16 Feb 2005 21:37 GMT
Yeah, you need to be capable of the discipline it takes to prepare your
own healthy foods.

-------------------------------
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