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Weight Loss Forum / General Topics / January 2007What are the symptoms of acute chlorine deficiency???????????????!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!
Richard Schultz wrote in http://groups.google.com/group/sci.life-extension/msg/ab9c99d4e0d834a5?hl=en& > But just what do you think gastric fluid > consists of? Enzymes and a small amount of HCl acid. If I were to completely rid myself of chlorine ions, I probably wouldn't have a sour stomach no matter what I ate. Any other ideas as to what symptoms I would experience if some mysterious power were to cause all the chlorine in my body to disappear? AFAIK, we don't need chlorine at all. Really, at all. I think that mysterious power would do me a great favor by eliminating those unecessary chlorine particles that invade my body. I would like to know what would happen if my body suddenly lost all its chlorine. http://www.feinberg.northwestern.edu/nutrition/factsheets/chlorine.html "Dietary requirements for chlorine have not been established because dietary deficiencies have not been observed." TC > Richard Schultz wrote in > http://groups.google.com/group/sci.life-extension/msg/ab9c99d4e0d834a5?hl=en& [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > I would like to know what would happen if my body suddenly lost all its > chlorine. http://www.feinberg.northwestern.edu/nutrition/factsheets/chlorine.html "Dietary requirements for chlorine have not been established because dietary deficiencies have not been observed." TC ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ I wanted to answer the question that was in the orginal post which was: What are the symptoms of acute chloride deficiency? I have a reference book related to understanding blood test results. I looked up the word "chloride" and found the following information: CHLORIDE: A score [on a blood test] that is below the Lab Reference Range may indicate: The adrenal gland deficiency known as Addison's Disease Intestinal obstruction Metabolic Acidosis common in diabetics > http://www.feinberg.northwestern.edu/nutrition/factsheets/chlorine.html > [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] > > Metabolic Acidosis common in diabetics http://endocrine.niddk.nih.gov/pubs/addison/addison.htm No mention of chloride in relation to Addisons's Disease. TC >http://endocrine.niddk.nih.gov/pubs/addison/addison.htm > >No mention of chloride in relation to Addisons's Disease. quote: "Because of salt loss, a craving for salty foods also is common." Troll, or moron, which is it? jack > >http://endocrine.niddk.nih.gov/pubs/addison/addison.htm > > [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > > jack Salt is not chloride, nor is it sodium. Both, by themselves, are dangerous and deadly. Salt is Sodium Chloride. Which is a safe compound to consume only in that form. You should know that. TC >What are the symptoms of acute chloride deficiency? If you could remove all the chlorine from a person they would die immediatly as nerves and muscles would stop working. When you remove the chlorine are you going to remove the electrons on the chloride ion? If so the positive charge left behind will cause a serious electric problem. Are you going to leave the counter balancing Na+ ions, or just take out chlorine and leave sodium metal? In either case you can see it is ridiculous. X X X X X Dear Radium: > Richard Schultz wrote in > http://groups.google.com/group/sci.life-extension/msg/ab9c99d4e0d834a5?hl=en& [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > completely rid myself of chlorine ions, I probably > wouldn't have a sour stomach no matter what I ate. I disagree. The "sour stomach" can be produced by bacteria as well. > Any other ideas as to what symptoms I would experience if some > mysterious power were to cause all the chlorine in my body to [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > I would like to know what would happen if my body suddenly lost all its > chlorine. http://www.traceminerals.com/research/chloride.html alkalosis hypochloremia anorexia David A. Smith > Dear Radium: > [quoted text clipped - 27 lines] > > David A. Smith What if the amount of sodium ions in the body were in a healthy state? Would extreme lack of chloride cause any significant symptoms? Dear Radium: >> Dear Radium: ... >> > AFAIK, we don't need chlorine at all. Really, at all. >> > I think that mysterious power would do me a great [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > a healthy state? Would extreme lack of chloride cause > any significant symptoms? With chlorine goes sodium, according to the medical literature. Do you want to substitute another halogen, because that is your only option? David A. Smith > With chlorine goes sodium, according to the medical literature. Not necessarily. Sodium ions can be lone in the body. > Do you want to substitute another halogen, because that is your > only option? Nope. Dear Radium: >> With chlorine goes sodium, according to the >> medical literature. > > Not necessarily. Sodium ions can be lone in the body. No, they cannot. They are a net positive charge, that is neutralized by something. If it isn't Cl-, then it will be OH-... which is much worse. >> Do you want to substitute another halogen, because >> that is your only option? > > Nope. Afraid so. David A. Smith > No, they cannot. They are a net positive charge, that is > neutralized by something. If it isn't Cl-, then it will be > OH-... which is much worse. Damn! I lose again!! Dear Radium: > > No, they cannot. They are a net positive charge, that is > > neutralized by something. If it isn't Cl-, then it will be > > OH-... which is much worse. > > Damn! I lose again!! If you learned something, what have you lost? David A. Smith In sci.chem dlzc <dlzc1@cox.net> wrote: :> Damn! I lose again!! : : If you learned something, what have you lost? Unfortunately, the obvious lesson (that he should make the effort to learn some elementary chemistry, biology and physics) appears to be one that he is incapable of learning. ----- Richard Schultz schultr@mail.biu.ac.il Department of Chemistry, Bar-Ilan University, Ramat-Gan, Israel Opinions expressed are mine alone, and not those of Bar-Ilan University ----- "an optimist is a guy/ that has never had/ much experience" Dear Richard Schultz: > In sci.chem dlzc <dlzc1@cox.net> wrote: > [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > biology and physics) appears to be one that he is > incapable of learning. Well, the signs are not good, but there is always hope... David A. Smith In sci.chem "N:dlzc D:aol T:com \(dlzc\)" <dlzc@aol.com> wrote: :> Unfortunately, the obvious lesson (that he should :> make the effort to learn some elementary chemistry, :> biology and physics) appears to be one that he is :> incapable of learning. : : Well, the signs are not good, but there is always hope... Well, since even planaria can learn (eventually) the difference between left and right, maybe you're right. ----- Richard Schultz schultr@mail.biu.ac.il Department of Chemistry, Bar-Ilan University, Ramat-Gan, Israel Opinions expressed are mine alone, and not those of Bar-Ilan University ----- "an optimist is a guy/ that has never had/ much experience" > Richard Schultz wrote in > http://groups.google.com/group/sci.life-extension/msg/ab9c99d4e0d834a5?hl=en& [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > I would like to know what would happen if my body suddenly lost all its > chlorine. You also wouldn't have blood. Your blood serum contains sodium chloride. So much for not dying. > You also wouldn't have blood. Your blood serum contains sodium chloride. > So much for not dying. Can't the serum contain sodium ions without chloride ions? If not, whats stopping such an existence? > > You also wouldn't have blood. Your blood serum contains sodium chloride. > > So much for not dying. > > Can't the serum contain sodium ions without chloride ions? If not, > whats stopping such an existence? You need some sort of counterion. If it's not chloride ion, what is it? >> > You also wouldn't have blood. Your blood serum contains sodium chloride. >> > So much for not dying. [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >You need some sort of counterion. If it's not >chloride ion, what is it? Well it could be sulphate, phosphate, bicarbonate, bromide or organic acid. X X X X X >> You also wouldn't have blood. Your blood serum contains sodium chloride. >> So much for not dying. > > Can't the serum contain sodium ions without chloride ions? If not, > whats stopping such an existence? Sure -- you could have hydroxyl ions instead, in which case you'd have a blood pH of about 12 and die. Or you could have acetate ions instead, in which case acetate toxicity would be lethal. Or you could have fluoride ions instead, in which case the neurotoxicity of hyperfluorosis would kill you stone dead. There are, after all, *lots* of anions. Substituting any of them for all of the (copious) chlorine in your body would be quite, quite lethal. Don't assume that Mother Nature is totally clueless. | Bogus as it might seem, people, this really is a deliverable | | e-mail address. Of course, there isn't REALLY a lumber cartel. | | There isn't really a Santa Claus, but try www.santaclaus.com. | +--------------- D. C. Sessions <dcs@lumbercartel.com> --------------+ > Enzymes and a small amount of HCl acid. If I were to completely rid > myself of chlorine ions, I probably wouldn't have a sour stomach no > matter what I ate. True -- you'd be stone dead. | Bogus as it might seem, people, this really is a deliverable | | e-mail address. Of course, there isn't REALLY a lumber cartel. | | There isn't really a Santa Claus, but try www.santaclaus.com. | +--------------- D. C. Sessions <dcs@lumbercartel.com> --------------+ > But just what do you think gastric fluid > consists of? "Enzymes and a small amount of HCl acid. If I were to completely rid myself of chlorine ions, I probably wouldn't have a sour stomach no matter what I ate. Any other ideas as to what symptoms I would experience if some mysterious power were to cause all the chlorine in my body to disappear? AFAIK, we don't need chlorine at all. Really, at all. I think that mysterious power would do me a great favor by eliminating those unecessary chlorine particles that invade my body. I would like to know what would happen if my body suddenly lost all its chlorine." How much hcl do you think is produced? In answer to your last question, likely death. What function do you think the hcl plays in digestion and what would happen if it did not do so? What other parts of metabolism and normal life process do you think depend on chlorine? > But just what do you think gastric fluid > consists of? "Enzymes and a small amount of HCl acid. If I were to completely rid myself of chlorine ions, I probably wouldn't have a sour stomach no matter what I ate. Any other ideas as to what symptoms I would experience if some mysterious power were to cause all the chlorine in my body to disappear? AFAIK, we don't need chlorine at all. Really, at all. I think that mysterious power would do me a great favor by eliminating those unecessary chlorine particles that invade my body. I would like to know what would happen if my body suddenly lost all its chlorine." How much hcl do you think is produced? In answer to your last question, likely death. What function do you think the hcl plays in digestion and what would happen if it did not do so? What other parts of metabolism and normal life process do you think depend on chlorine? ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ I found a book in my small book collection related to this subject. It's a 200 page book related to the dangers of table salt (sodium chloride). One of the authors is a medical doctor. The authors claim that sodium chloride is the cause of high blood pressure, heart disease, kidney disease, osteoporosis and asthma. "The Salt Solution" by Herb Boynton, Mark F. McCarty and Richard, D. Moore, M.D. I am salt sensitive and learned that I can control my Blood pressure and fluid retention problem by limiting the salt in my diet and eating foods (eg bananas) that increase the amount of potassium in my diet. After you read the above mentioned book, you will be an expert related to sodium chloride and will no longer need to ask questions about this subject. Jason ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > > But just what do you think gastric fluid > > consists of? [quoted text clipped - 35 lines] >After you read the above mentioned book, you will be an expert related to >sodium chloride and will no longer need to ask questions about this subject. My questions to him were rhetorical. They were to be an education for him in answering them. As for salt sensitivity when added in excess to food, it is a genetic factor affecting some of the population, it is not a blanket statement to say we don't need it. Which of the two elements in salt is the source of salt sensitivity, "sodium chloride"? What would happen if all salt were removed from your body? Why is a craving for salt so strong in humans and some other animals? What is it about human blood that reminds us of an evolutionary origin as animals in the sea? Along with a metallic taste, what other substance can be detected in blood by taste? >I found a book in my small book collection related to this subject. It's a >200 page book related to the dangers of table salt (sodium chloride). One [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] >fluid retention problem by limiting the salt in my diet and eating foods >(eg bananas) that increase the amount of potassium in my diet. That has nothing to do with chlorine (or chloride). It is the sodium that is the culprit (for those who are sensitive to it). Potassium chloride is sold as a salt substitute for those who want/need to reduce sodium intake. bob Radium: > Any other ideas as to what symptoms I would experience if some > mysterious power were to cause all the chlorine in my body to > disappear? Permanent deadness. Actually you don't have any chlorine in your body. You do however have a lot of chlorides, and I assume that's what you were talking about. > AFAIK, we don't need chlorine at all. Yes we do. > Really, at all. No really, we do. > I think that > mysterious power would do me a great favor by eliminating those > unecessary chlorine particles that invade my body. There are no mysterios powers, and if you really want to die there are simpler ways.  SignatureErlend Meyer When I am king you will be first against the wall > Richard Schultz wrote in > http://groups.google.com/group/sci.life-extension/msg/ab9c99d4e0d834a5?hl=en& [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > I would like to know what would happen if my body suddenly lost all its > chlorine. choride is an essential element. see http://www.traceminerals.com/research/chloride.html j. > > Richard Schultz wrote in > > http://groups.google.com/group/sci.life-extension/msg/ab9c99d4e0d834a5?hl=en& [quoted text clipped - 22 lines] > > j. That is nonsense being advocated by industries that have excess chloride to sell. Kinda like what they did with fluoride, another poison. TC > choride is an essential element. > > see http://www.traceminerals.com/research/chloride.html "That is nonsense being advocated by industries that have excess chloride to sell. Kinda like what they did with fluoride, another poison." As par for the course you did not refer to the link or you would know in the first paragraph alone why the above is pure rhetorical bombast. If we need an "anti" sound bite on any subject we need only turn to you, even if only generic noise for any occasion. >> choride is an essential element. >> [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] >chloride to sell. Kinda like what they did with fluoride, another >poison. Excess chloride to sell? You are obsessed by your hatred of industry. Look sunshine, sodium chloride is essential to life. But, it is almost impossible to show a deficiency because of its omnipresence. Within 100 miles of the sea, it is even in the atmosphere. jack > >> choride is an essential element. > >> [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > > jack You should learn a bit about bio-chemistry. Sodium Chloride is not the same as Sodium or Chloride or Sodium and Chloride. Sodium is deadly. Chloride is deadly. Sodium Chloride is salt and is safe and edible. TC >> >> choride is an essential element. >> >> [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > > TC Yes, in very limited quantities, otherwise the level of "sodium" in the body gets too high. On 18 Jan 2007 13:29:14 -0800, "TC" <tunderbar@hotmail.com> wrote: >> choride is an essential element. >> [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] >chloride to sell. Kinda like what they did with fluoride, another >poison. Excess chloride to sell? You are obsessed by your hatred of industry. Look sunshine, sodium chloride is essential to life. But, it is almost impossible to show a deficiency because of its omnipresence. Within 100 miles of the sea, it is even in the atmosphere. jack ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ jack, You are 100 per cent correct. I am on a low salt diet and now check the labels on every food product that I buy. Many products (eg soup) contains really high lables of salt. It's difficult to find low salt foods in most grocery stores. I now buy most of my food at the local health food store. They even sell soup that has NO salt. Most people do not realize that they eat MUCH for table salt than what they should eat. I do believe that eating too much salt can cause blood pressure problems in many people--especially if they are above the age of 50. jason ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > On 18 Jan 2007 13:29:14 -0800, "TC" <tunderbar@hotmail.com> wrote: > [quoted text clipped - 29 lines] > jason > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ In terms of causation, this is largely a myth. Only one in four is genetically predisposed to high sodium retention, and the available science shows clearly that a salt-restricted diet is not associated with fewer cardiovascular events or disease [ref. http://www.saltinstitute.org/28.html.] People forget that most bio-markers for "disease" are just coincident phenomenon that have nothing to do with causation. That means two people can have the same bio-markers without having the same (or any) disease response. One half of all heart attacks occur in people with "normal" cholesterol readings. Although blood pressure is commonly associated with disease rates, this does not mean your particular bio-markers are a forecast. The RDI for sodium intake is larger than for any other nutrient, so it should come as no surprise that reduced salt intake is not going to make a hill of beans difference to longevity. The antagonist/synergist relationship characteristic of every mineral, including the electrolytes, means we should pay more attention to the potential imbalance in serum mineral ratios rather than try to manage our disease risk with one of many possible co-factors. If you want to improve you disease risk, observe whether you are sensitive to salt retention. If you are, you will experience edema, and that is indeed a heart stressor. If not, then sodium intake is not an issue for you. A diet that *does* represent an improvement in your disease risk profile is one low in grains (not more than 15% of total caloric intake, with a preference for sprouted grains), low to no dairy (not more than 15% of caloric intake, with a preference for cultured or raw dairy), grass-fed meat if you are not a vegetarian (not more than 15% of total caloric intake), and fruits and vegetables making up the remaining 55-70%. To be sure you get adequate potassium, eat one whole avocado or several bananas each week. Eat wild salmon twice or more monthly, or you can take 2tsp of quality cod liver oil daily. Eat a variety of *raw* nuts several times a week. Avoid packaged foods (for MANY reasons more important than sodium levels.) Do all that and you'll liver longer than most people with equivalent genetics. PeterB Jason Johnson wrote: > In article <qas0r2p6hs7j7q04qovl9l3dm1affe4h6t@4ax.com>, > spamfree@spam.heaven wrote: [quoted text clipped - 32 lines] > jason > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ In terms of causation, this is largely a myth. Only one in four is genetically predisposed to high sodium retention, and the available science shows clearly that a salt-restricted diet is not associated with fewer cardiovascular events or disease [ref. http://www.saltinstitute.org/28.html.] People forget that most bio-markers for "disease" are just coincident phenomenon that have nothing to do with causation. That means two people can have the same bio-markers without having the same (or any) disease response. One half of all heart attacks occur in people with "normal" cholesterol readings. Although blood pressure is commonly associated with disease rates, this does not mean your particular bio-markers are a forecast. The RDI for sodium intake is larger than for any other nutrient, so it should come as no surprise that reduced salt intake is not going to make a hill of beans difference to longevity. The antagonist/synergist relationship characteristic of every mineral, including the electrolytes, means we should pay more attention to the potential imbalance in serum mineral ratios rather than try to manage our disease risk with one of many possible co-factors. If you want to improve you disease risk, observe whether you are sensitive to salt retention. If you are, you will experience edema, and that is indeed a heart stressor. If not, then sodium intake is not an issue for you. A diet that *does* represent an improvement in your disease risk profile is one low in grains (not more than 15% of total caloric intake, with a preference for sprouted grains), low to no dairy (not more than 15% of caloric intake, with a preference for cultured or raw dairy), grass-fed meat if you are not a vegetarian (not more than 15% of total caloric intake), and fruits and vegetables making up the remaining 55-70%. To be sure you get adequate potassium, eat one whole avocado or several bananas each week. Eat wild salmon twice or more monthly, or you can take 2tsp of quality cod liver oil daily. Eat a variety of *raw* nuts several times a week. Avoid packaged foods (for MANY reasons more important than sodium levels.) Do all that and you'll liver longer than most people with equivalent genetics. PeterB ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ PeterB, I am salt sensitive. I retain salt and water. I experience edema. That's the reason that I avoid eating foods that have high amounts of salt. My research indicates that many of the people that have this problem have weak kidneys. Doctor Mackenzie Walser discusses this subject in his book which is entitled, "Coping With Kidney Disease". Jason ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Jason Johnson wrote: > > In article <qas0r2p6hs7j7q04qovl9l3dm1affe4h6t@4ax.com>, [quoted text clipped - 81 lines] > Jason > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Alright, but don't think of it as "weak kidneys," think of it as your phenotype's relationship to ancestors whose sodium or potassium requirements would have been compromised by your "adapted" diet. Due to biochemical individuality, we all respond differently to the same amount of individual nutrients, whereas most disease attributed to "organ failure" is just an imbalance in metabolic processes that results in organ stress. A better approach is to raise your intake of foods rich in sodium antagonists (ie., potassium, magnesium, zinc, and folic acid) rather than reducing your sodium intake to potentially dangerous levels. You could accomplish this with magnesium aspartate or glycinate supplements, which are well absorbed (avoid magnesium oxide), and folic acid tablets, but I would avoid potassium supplements because they don't work well. > On 18 Jan 2007 13:29:14 -0800, "TC" <tunderbar@hotmail.com> wrote: > [quoted text clipped - 29 lines] > jason > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ It also makes you retain water, which can affect your pressure and your heart. I do not have table salt in my home. There is NO need for it. >> On 18 Jan 2007 13:29:14 -0800, "TC" <tunderbar@hotmail.com> wrote: >> [quoted text clipped - 34 lines] > >I do not have table salt in my home. There is NO need for it. I use a spicy mixture called Lemon Pepper which has citric acid, garlic , black pepper(20%), paprika, celery seed, lemon peel granules sugar and onion and stuff with somewhat less sodium chloride. Great on a rare rump steak :=) jack >>> On 18 Jan 2007 13:29:14 -0800, "TC" <tunderbar@hotmail.com> wrote: >>> [quoted text clipped - 40 lines] > > jack Try it on fresh flounder, caught and filleted minutes before broiling. It also does a nice job with yellowfin and bluefish. >You are 100 per cent correct. I am on a low salt diet and now check the >labels on every food product that I buy. Many products (eg soup) contains [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >eating too much salt can cause blood pressure problems in many >people--especially if they are above the age of 50. Hi Jason. Yes there are some folk who have problems with sodium chloride (or any other sodium ions, to be precise. Diuretics can help here, but of course not taking so much in the first place is best if it can be managed. A trick that an old plumber friend of mine did was to "borrow" large bottles of distilled water from the large laboratory stills that he helped to service. Tap water where I come from can be up to 500ppm tds (total dissolved solids) which is mostly from sodium chloride. That would save him a gram of sodium chloride intake just from his two litres per day. jack On Fri, 19 Jan 2007 12:02:47 -0800, jason@nospam.com (Jason Johnson) wrote: >You are 100 per cent correct. I am on a low salt diet and now check the >labels on every food product that I buy. Many products (eg soup) contains [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >eating too much salt can cause blood pressure problems in many >people--especially if they are above the age of 50. Hi Jason. Yes there are some folk who have problems with sodium chloride (or any other sodium ions, to be precise. Diuretics can help here, but of course not taking so much in the first place is best if it can be managed. A trick that an old plumber friend of mine did was to "borrow" large bottles of distilled water from the large laboratory stills that he helped to service. Tap water where I come from can be up to 500ppm tds (total dissolved solids) which is mostly from sodium chloride. That would save him a gram of sodium chloride intake just from his two litres per day. jack ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Thanks, I already use that trick. I only drink distilled water. I have had problems with diurectics. They caused be to have major electrolyte problems. I have minor kidney problems. Jason ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ >>> choride is an essential element. >>> [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > impossible to show a deficiency because of its omnipresence. Within > 100 miles of the sea, it is even in the atmosphere. I live right on the (salt)water and that stuff is corrosive, just from the atmosphere. >>>> choride is an essential element. >>>> [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] >I live right on the (salt)water and that stuff is corrosive, just from >the atmosphere. I used to live at the beach, and my car radiators corroded from the outside. The fins all fell off. jack >>>>> choride is an essential element. >>>>> [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > I used to live at the beach, and my car radiators corroded from the > outside. The fins all fell off. I had to use a special coating for the metal fixtures used on the exterior of my house. All new construction had special nails and screws. I use polyurethane coating on my deck and dock where I can. Even special treated lumber does not last. Salt water is nasty stuff. >>>>>> choride is an essential element. >>>>>> [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] > I use polyurethane coating on my deck and dock where I can. Even special > treated lumber does not last. Salt water is nasty stuff. What beach is that? I lived within a couple hundred yards of the beach in Santa Monica, California for 14 years - no problem. Car fine Wood porch fine (House about 50 years old) girls fine BUT yes salt water is not the greatest. The Entire East coast from Vermont to Florida is crud and it has little to do with salt water. >>>>>>> choride is an essential element. >>>>>>> [quoted text clipped - 29 lines] > The Entire East coast from Vermont to Florida is crud and it has little to > do with salt water. It is an inlet, and I am directly on the water. I do not have a couple of hundred yards of buffer. Death! Of course, just like it was reported in the news you would have to be some kind of a mentally defective moron to drink that much water. <snip> > I would like to know what would happen if my body suddenly lost all its > chlorine. Well, if your body had much chlorine to begin with, you'd already be hurtin'. I mean scorched lungs, burned skin and eyes...it's a really nasty substance. If you're talking about chlor*IDE*, a sudden loss of all your body's chloride would result in a sudden loss of life. It is essential to the function of basically every cell in your body. Mark, MD > If you're talking about chlor*IDE*, Yes I am. > a sudden loss of all your body's > chloride would result in a sudden loss of life. It is essential to the > function of basically every cell in your body. What symptoms specific to acute chlorine loss would occur before death? >> If you're talking about chlor*IDE*, > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > What symptoms specific to acute chlorine loss would occur before death? Falling down and breathing stopped. Yeh, I know, I'm nasty > Falling down and breathing stopped. Any interesting neurological symptoms before the above? Any seizures? Dear Radium: >> Falling down and breathing stopped. > > Any interesting neurological symptoms before the > above? Any seizures? Any idea what you will use for the anion that Cl- provides, so that the sodium-potassium pump so necessary for cell health continues to function? David A. Smith > Any idea what you will use for the anion that Cl- provides, so > that the sodium-potassium pump so necessary for cell health > continues to function? I wish I knew Dear Radium: >> Any idea what you will use for the anion that Cl- provides, so >> that the sodium-potassium pump so necessary for cell health >> continues to function? > > I wish I knew You've got bromine and iodine to choose from. Iodine is important but you can get too much of it. Bromine is OK in small quantities, but can interfere with iodine and more-or-less deactivate your thyroid. If your gut is hurting you, have you seen a doctor? There are a number of causes for "sour stomach", some of which medicine has answers. I used to have a duodenal ulcer, and took Tagamet for it. Along with lifestyle changes like: a divorce, a change of job, going back to school, and changing to a more bland diet. Turns out, it was likely something an antibiotic could have fixed. David A. Smith >> Falling down and breathing stopped. > > Any interesting neurological symptoms before the above? Any seizures? I really don't know. I just thought I would make a dumb statement in jest before a few made dumb statements in all seriousness. Any stated symptoms would be hypothetical or very narrowly anecdotal as I doubt there are any easily obtained records of people succumbing to the deficiency. > > Falling down and breathing stopped. > > Any interesting neurological symptoms before the above? Any seizures? I'm not sure there's even anything such as a specific disease state characterized as "Hypochloremia" alone. The obvious example of hypochloremia as *part* of another disease state would be metabolis alkalosis, such as might be seen with profuse vomiting resulting in loss on HCl from the GI tract (and compensatory increased reabsorption of HCO3- by the kidneys as it would be the prevalent anion available if the amount of chloride were low -- thus resulting in the alkalosis.) You would see weakness, lethargy, failure to thrive (in infants and children), but these really represent the alkalosis and not specifically the hypochloremia. Chloride is such a ubiquitous anion in living animal systems that any significant downward perturbation in its levels would simply be incompatible with life. Musing on "What would happen if I radically reduced my body's level of chlorine (sic)" is just as much a waste of mental effort as saying, "Let's say I removed my lungs. What would happen next?" Sorry to burst your bubble, but you're flogging a dead horse with this one. Mark, MD >> > Falling down and breathing stopped. >> [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > > Mark, MD Careful, PETA may be monitoring the posts. > Musing on "What would happen if I radically reduced my body's level of > chlorine (sic)" is just as much a waste of mental effort as saying, > "Let's say I removed my lungs. What would happen next?" Sorry to > burst your bubble, but you're flogging a dead horse with this one. That generally covers all of Radium's posts. >> If you're talking about chlor*IDE*, > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > >What symptoms specific to acute chlorine loss would occur before death? A white light in the distance, and approaching very fast.... jack Gastric fluid (juice)is one of the juices produced by the gastric glands (oxyntic is one of them). It contains enzymes like Pepsinogen (inactive form of pepsin), etc, Hydrochloric acid and some other organic and inorganic substances. Deficiency of chlorine is a very uncommon physiological condition, which if present, may lead to a situation where the human 'internal environment', especially the blood, becomes more basic (alkalosis). It worths mentioning, here, that the human body is not static, but dynamic, self-directory and self regulatory. Normally, when such abnormal conditions occur, the body itself, with the help of the co-operative actions of different cells, tissues, organs, and even systems (in short, body buffer systems, which are many), the lost homeostatic balance is restored and the PH returns to normal. Chlorine enters into the body system through food ingestion, mainly inform of sodium chloride, potassium chloride and side effects caused by excess ingestion are normally from the cation and not chlorine. ABBAS EL-TA'ALU |
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