Weight Loss Forum / General Topics / December 2007
Ever hit a plateau like this?
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jeff.gobel@gmail.com - 15 Dec 2007 15:35 GMT I have hit a plateau like never before. Frustrating.
I have been religiously tracking everything that goes in my mouth. I manage my calories to a 1000 daily deficit, but I eat 2000+ per day, as I exercise quite a bit. I am doing 60 minutes of elliptical a day, staying precisely at 65% max heart rate to hopefully burn fat. I am playing tennis three times a week, and I have been doing 30 minutes of strength training three times a week. Given this, I would expect to lose about 2 pounds a week, and I have been averaging a little more than that over the last ten weeks. I am 43, 6 ft, and my starting weight was 262 lbs.
The last three weekly weigh-ins were:
11/26/07 237.5 12/3/07 236.4 (lost 1.1) 12/10/07 236.6 (gained .2?)
Where is my 2 pounds a week that I am working so hard for?
According to my scale, my body fat percentage has dropped from 30 to 29 over the last three weeks, but my experience is that the body fat % readings tend to be unreliable to the tune of 1-3%, so who knows?
Anyone ever hit a wall like this? My friends say, just stay the course and you will drop 3 or 4 pounds on one of your next weigh-ins. And my weight loss has come in chunks in the past. Why should this be so? What happened to 3500 calories per pound? There must be some other mechanism at work here.
I weigh myself with the same scale, on the same day, first thing in the morning, naked, after visiting the restroom. Don't know how I could make the weight measurements more reliable.
Any thoughts from all you good folks on the subject?
Cheers,
-Jeff
mikesmith9999@hotmail.com - 16 Dec 2007 05:07 GMT I would like to go beyond the "Calorie deficit" and the workout you do. I would like to know not the quantity of food you're taking in (number of calories) but the quality of it. What and how much veggies did you have in the last three days?
jeff.gobel@gmail.com - 16 Dec 2007 15:56 GMT On Dec 15, 9:07 pm, "mikesmith9...@hotmail.com" <mikesmith9...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> I would like to go beyond the "Calorie deficit" and the workout you > do. I would like to know not the quantity of food you're taking in > (number of calories) but the quality of it. What and how much veggies > did you have in the last three days? Thanks for the reply. Actually, I am somewhat embarrassed to say that I have eaten hardly any vegetables in the last three days:
2 cups salad (mixed greens) 1 cup mixed vegetables 0.75 cup corn
And here is everything else from the past three days:
1.25 cups raspberries 1 apple
6.75 cups oatmeal 2 corn tortilla 1.75 cup Mexican rice 4 slices garlic bread 4 slices white bread 1 pancake
3 oz almonds
2.5 oz hash browns 4 oz french fries
2.5 eggs 2 sausage links 4 oz beef jerky 6 oz steak 6 oz meatloaf 6 slices bacon
3 tbsp salsa 2 tbsp low fat Italian dressing 0.25 cup brown gravy 2 tbsp pancake syrup 1 tbsp butter
21 tortilla chips 1 oatmeal cookie 6 cups microwave popcorn 15 cups movie popcorn (went crazy when daughter and I saw Enchanted) 1 bite of snickers bar
0.5 cup chicken soup
I am traveling right now, but even at home I eat only slightly more veggies / salad than this; although I perhaps generally eat a little more fruit.
I have always been under the impression that as long as the calories in / out trended correctly, from a weight loss perspective rather than an overall health / nutritional standpoint, WHAT I ate should not make any difference. Is this not correct?
Thanks for your help.
-Jeff
mikesmith9999@hotmail.com - 16 Dec 2007 18:11 GMT > Thanks for the reply. Actually, I am somewhat embarrassed to say that I have eaten hardly any vegetables in the last three days:
I have always been under the impression that as long as the calories
> in / out trended correctly, from a weight loss perspective rather than > an overall health / nutritional standpoint, WHAT I ate should not make [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > -Jeff Don't be embarassed with the past. The past is gone. What matters is what you're doing from now on.
It's my theory that what you eat does matter because what really matters is the vitamins, minerals and other stuff like Omega-3 that you take in. I would be glad to hear about a study that surveyed two guys of the same height and weight, one eating 2000 calories of tortillas, french fries, and pancake syrup and the other guy eating 2000 calories of salad with some fish, chicken and meat for a month. I would like to have these results after those two months: 1. Weight 2. Blood results. 3. Heart condition
Unfortunately, I'm not in a position yet where I can give lots of advice as I'm still overweight. The day I'll be skinny, I'll be able to talk with authority. Until then, I'll stay humble. :)
The other day I was talking to a very skinny guy about my weight problems. He told me, "You just have to avoid fast food restaurants and you should be fine." Pfff! I never go to those places!
jeff.gobel@gmail.com - 19 Dec 2007 07:28 GMT On Dec 16, 10:11 am, "mikesmith9...@hotmail.com" <mikesmith9...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> > Thanks for the reply. Actually, I am somewhat embarrassed to say that > [quoted text clipped - 29 lines] > problems. He told me, "You just have to avoid fast food restaurants > and you should be fine." Pfff! I never go to those places! I think what you suggest would make a fantastic study. If they could somehow do it with a reasonable sample of folks, some eating anything they want (junk included), and others on a strict "healthy" diet, but all with the same number of calories and comparable activity regimen, would be very interesting to know any differences in terms of weight loss. From an overall health standpoint, I'm sure you are right about what you eat making a difference.
Personally, I kind of felt that I would take things in stages; lose some weight, make some healthier eating choices; lose more weight, eat even better. It is hard to change everything at once. At least I'm eating one bowl of oatmeal for breakfast instead of half a box of Lucky Charms :-)
As for staying humble, I lost lots of weight before, but put it back on at an alarming rate when I went off the program. I can speak with complete authority on how to gain weight in a hurry. Taking weight off is a whole different story, but I certainly value the opinion of those who really know what it means to be heavy. Thanks for your help. Let's get skinnier together.
Best,
-Jeff
Cubit - 16 Dec 2007 15:49 GMT >I have hit a plateau like never before. Frustrating. > [quoted text clipped - 35 lines] > > -Jeff I successfully lost a lot of weight. During the long 2 pound per week process there were a few months where I did weight training. I saw no change in my rate of weight loss.
I have not read it yet, but I gather Gary Taubes new book makes a case against exercise as being effective for weightloss.
To lose weight I need to eat about 1400 calories per day compared to your 2000.
If your calorie measurement is accurate, the good thing is that you have established your break even burn rate: 2000 calories Now, you just need to eat less.
Frequent small meals can make "eating less" easier.
jeff.gobel@gmail.com - 16 Dec 2007 16:14 GMT > <jeff.go...@gmail.com> wrote in message > [quoted text clipped - 55 lines] > > Frequent small meals can make "eating less" easier. Thanks for replying. Small meals makes sense to me too, and I generally try to do this; will focus on it more.
I sure hope that I can continue to lose weight on 2000 calories or so through exercise, as eating 1400 is just really tough for me (tried it for a while). I'll take a look at " Good Calories, Bad Calories", if that is the book you are referring to; maybe it will provide some new distinctions for me. Frankly, though, the more I read the more confusing it all gets; there are so many conflicting opinions. I've always sort of subscribed to the Dr. Dean school of its just calories in vs. out. Eat less and move more. I just don't want to eat THAT much less :-) Would rather move more if at all possible, and eat reasonably. I was hoping to use a level of eating and exercise that I could follow for the rest of my life, so I don't yo-yo. I just don't think I could go through the rest of my life eating fewer than about 2000 calories.
My highest weight was 296 lbs. A couple of years ago, I lost 70 lbs, following a similar program of watching calories and exercising. In that weight loss run I did hit a short 2 week plateau, and eventually the weight started coming back off again, but I'll be darned if I can explain why. If anything, I ate slightly more coming out of the plateau rather than less. Weird.
When I was re-gaining weight recently, I was probably eating about 5,000 cals a day!! So, I guess I should take some heart in the fact that, if nothing else, I have bucked the upward trend :-) Thanks for your support.
Best Wishes,
-Jeff
Del Cecchi - 16 Dec 2007 21:03 GMT >> <jeff.go...@gmail.com> wrote in message >> [quoted text clipped - 77 lines] > > -Jeff Yes, and I have attributed it to fluid retention. Sometimes your body seems to want to hold on to water. It can be discouraging to see the scale stick or even jump up. If you have been eating out, that will do it because restaurant food is high in salt.
jeff.gobel@gmail.com - 19 Dec 2007 07:38 GMT On Dec 16, 1:03 pm, Del Cecchi <delcecchinospamoftheno...@gmail.com> wrote:
> jeff.go...@gmail.com wrote: > >> <jeff.go...@gmail.com> wrote in message [quoted text clipped - 83 lines] > scale stick or even jump up. If you have been eating out, that will do > it because restaurant food is high in salt. Thanks for the reply. Water retention makes a lot of sense to me now. Salt is something that I am really going to have to work on. I eat tons of it in my current diet; I'm a bit of a salt-a-holic. Sounds like it would help my overall goals to find a way to gradually cut back along with the calorie considerations. Sure wouldn't hurt my blood pressure any.
Thank you.
-Jeff
Cubit - 31 Dec 2007 20:46 GMT Manipulating water retention misses the point. Body fat is the issue.
> On Dec 16, 1:03 pm, Del Cecchi <delcecchinospamoftheno...@gmail.com> > wrote: [quoted text clipped - 102 lines] > > -Jeff Patrick - 17 Dec 2007 14:01 GMT > I have hit a plateau like never before. Frustrating. > [quoted text clipped - 35 lines] > > -Jeff Don't forget to shock the monkey. I run and weight train for my exercise. During the summer my runs are usually between 3 - 3.8 miles depending on how hot it is. This winter, as the temperatures cooled I took my runs up to 5.1 miles and noticed a change in my body composition towards the more lean side as well as losing about 2 - 3 pounds. Keep in mind I am at the last ten pound stage and on a good day you can just make out some definition in my abs. This from a starting weight of 285 about 12 years ago and now I hover in the 180's.
Patrick
jeff.gobel@gmail.com - 19 Dec 2007 07:45 GMT > jeff.go...@gmail.com wrote: > > I have hit a plateau like never before. Frustrating. [quoted text clipped - 47 lines] > > Patrick Hi Patrick, sounds like you are where I want to be. Very encouraging, especially since you have kept it up for such a long stretch of time. Please help me understand the "Shock" part. Do you mean to vary (increase) my exercise a to break through when I hit a plateau? When you go back to your summer distance, do you expect to gain back the 2-3 lbs lost due to the 5 mile distance?
Thanks,
-Jeff
Patrick - 19 Dec 2007 14:40 GMT >>jeff.go...@gmail.com wrote: >> >>>I have hit a plateau like never before. Frustrating. <snip>
>>>Anyone ever hit a wall like this? My friends say, just stay the course >>>and you will drop 3 or 4 pounds on one of your next weigh-ins. And my [quoted text clipped - 33 lines] > > -Jeff Hey Jeff,
Shocking the system is doing something to get your body out of homeostasis. Your body gets used to doing the same thing over and over and finds a level of comfort so to speak. So shocking the system can be anything from increasing the duration or the intensity of your exercise. Likewise it can be eating more or less food.
I have found that I make some progress when I eat a little more, but not much more, for a month or so. I do this without gaining more than a pound. Then I hit my body with a deficit and drop a few pounds. Like I said, I'm at those last ten pounds and they are indeed the hardest. I could probably stop where I am at, but I have an image in my mind that I would like to attain.
The thing with running more is I am burning more calories and if I am already eating at a deficit my body responds by burning the stores (fat). With my weight training I have to be careful to make sure I am getting enough lean protein so my body doesn't start consuming muscle tissue also. I find that eating a cup or so of fat free cottages cheese before I sleep helps. 30 grams of protein. Now I am actually gaining weight, but can feel there is less and less fat on my body. So can my finacee. So I know it's not just my wishful thinking. LOL!
As for dropping my distance once the summer hits. I don't know. I'm guessing that I will probably just maintain. I only upped my run time by about 15 minutes, so I will still be running for over a half hour at a shot. I think as long as I am staying active and not overeating I will stay the same. Besides, I already threw out all my old clothes. A long time ago in a galaxy far far away I wore I size 42 waist and XXL shirts. Now I wear size 34 and medium shirts. I could probably squeeze into 32's if I wanted to.
Good luck with what you are doing. The main thing I have found with weight loss is that you have to believe in yourself and you have to make a commitment to yourself to do it. You have to want it more than anything else and you have to stick to your guns and give up yummies during the holidays and all the time until you hit your goal. It's not a short term endeavor, but a lifetime commitment to yourself and no other. It's a mind set.
Happy Holidays! Eat, drink, and be merry, but do the first two in moderation :)
Patrick
Probably more than I should have written, or more than you wanted to hear, but sometimes the fingers take over. Ha!
jeff.gobel@gmail.com - 20 Dec 2007 04:25 GMT > jeff.go...@gmail.com wrote: > [quoted text clipped - 89 lines] > Probably more than I should have written, or more than you wanted to > hear, but sometimes the fingers take over. Ha! Hi Patrick,
This is good stuff. I now understand what you mean by shocking the system and will keep it in mind going forward. What you are saying about the protein and weight training matches what I have heard elsewhere; sound advice, but I don't know how you can eat cottage cheese, I couldn't do it even to make all the finances in the world happy :-) Will have to substitute almonds or something.
34s and medium shirts is my holy grail. At my highest, I had a 48+ inch waist and XXL shirts were skin tight. Already down to 38's and XLs are loose, so things are thankfully trending in the right direction.
It's a little scary to think that it will get even more difficult to lose weight the closer I get to my goal, but I can think of reasons why this should be so. For example, once my thighs stop rubbing together my exercise mets will go down due to the decreased friction ;-)
I sincerely appreciate your encouragement. I fully intend to join you in the century club and stay there for good; some time next year if all goes as planned.
Regards and happy holidays,
-Jeff
Patrick - 20 Dec 2007 16:11 GMT >>jeff.go...@gmail.com wrote: >> [quoted text clipped - 118 lines] > > -Jeff Hey Jeff,
Listen, when you get to the last 10 pounds you will already be looking good and feeling good. For me it's just the difference between looking a little soft or looking real tight. I've just chosen the latter. It's my vision.
Yeah, if I didn't like cottage cheese I would probably be cooking up some egg beaters instead. At least something low fat and high protein.
Anyhow, my mantra has been "I know what I'm doing".
Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to you too. Hope to hear your ultimate success story some day. :)
Patrick
 Signature Patrick A. Smith Assistant System Administrator Ocean Circulation Group – USF - College of Marine Science http://ocgweb.marine.usf.edu Phone: 727 553-3334
The trouble with doing something right the first time is that nobody appreciates how difficult it was. - La Rochefoucauld
Doug Freyburger - 17 Dec 2007 21:55 GMT jeff.go...@gmail.com wrote:
> I have hit a plateau like never before. Frustrating. > ... [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > Any thoughts from all you good folks on the subject? Advice from Dr Atkins that really applies across the board -
A stall is defined as 4+ weeks without a cheat, without a new low, without a lost inch.
This definition is not arbitrary. It is to teach what are and aren't realisitic in expectations. The blunt fact of it is the time scale for loss is month to month no matter that fact's been hated by every dieter in history. Scale inaccuracies, water retnetion bounce, you name it. They all conspire against any realistic expectation that loss is possible each and every week.
Your most recent new low is 2 weeks ago. Therefore nothing is wrong and no reaction is called for. It's really that simple and that difficult to accept. But accept it anyways.
Another consideration - Rate of loss is proportional to amount left to lose. Not, calorie deficts do NOT enter into this. Someone with 100 to lose loses faster than someone with 50 to lose loses after than someone in the last 10 pounds. By the time you no longer have 100+ to lose the rate is no longer fast enough for the weekly loss rate to overwhelm water retention bounce, and further caloric reduction does nothing to change this.
You are doing fine. Really. Breath deeply. Relax. Stay with your plan.
jeff.gobel@gmail.com - 19 Dec 2007 07:34 GMT > jeff.go...@gmail.com wrote: > [quoted text clipped - 34 lines] > You are doing fine. Really. Breath deeply. Relax. Stay with > your plan. This is a great reply, thanks! And as it turns out, you are 100% correct too. I just got back from my travels, weighed myself, and found I had "lost" 5.2 lbs this week. Plateau busted. There is no way that I actually lost 5 pounds this week (I know what I ate and how much I moved), some had to have come in the preceding "plateau" weeks, but is just now showing up on the scale. Water retention makes sense to me, and is probably something I had not considered strongly enough. OK, I know now not to panic and take a longer term view. Thank you so much for your information and encouragement.
-Jeff
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