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Weight Loss Forum / General Topics / March 2004the results
Here's a brief summary of what I'm up against according to my endocrinologist. I have two separate issues. Issue 1 is low estrogen/high testosterone/high dhea-s combined with the symptoms I've exhibited have lead him to surmise that I have some form of insulin resistance. It would be PCOS, but I don't have the symptoms or blood chemistry for it. He has put me on metformin (the generic of Glucophage). He said that this combined with my typical diet and exercise should give me control over my weight again. It's like Chris said about thyroid meds - it won't make me lose weight by itself but will make what I'm doing actually work. The doctor told me that this should also provide some relief regarding appetite and food cravings Issue 2 is that I've had rising serum calcium levels since last summer and it's still going up which means I have some sort of growth on one of the 4 parathyroid glands. I'll be getting regular tests to make sure I'm not forming kidney stones and I'll also be getting a bone scan in a few months to keep an eye on bone density. If any of these become a problem then I'll have to get the growth removed. I will need to cut back on high impact exercise temporarily as I may be more prone to stress fractures but that only means running 2-3x a week instead of 4-5 (3-4 miles instead of 5-6) and taking a full day off every week. I've decided not to enter any races in April or May but I will be running the Dead Skunk 5 mile in June. That I hadn't completely given up on maintaining my weight loss in spite of the effort it was taking was a Good Thing and something he doesn't see often. That this kind of thing would occur *after* losing weight is another oddity since technically I've done everything right to prevent type 2 diabetes. We discussed diet and that I appear to be somewhat carb-sensitive. The endo didn't think it would be a bad thing for me to just give up sugar, flour, and rice altogether as long as I was getting sufficient carbs from vegetables, fruit, and dairy. I'll be using protein powder shakes with fruit for convenience and doing something like Jayjay's meat and salad diet to limit myself to 1200-1500 cal/day in 5-6 meals until I get down to my goal weight and the water stuff finally stops. It's going to be *months* before I see any results from this - at least 6 months until the androgen reactions stop. I do completely understand how a person can do so much to lose weight and then give up. I've never totally given up, but it hasn't been easy at ALL. When you stay at 1200 cal/day and begin to gain weight in spite of exercising your a.s off, it's not easy to keep the faith and in my case all it did was feed into my eating disorders. I knew maintenance would be a challenge and I never denied that, I just never expected it to be a constant freakin fight. Thanks again for the support. Jenn "JMA" > Here's a brief summary of what I'm up against according to my > endocrinologist. I have two separate issues. [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > doing actually work. The doctor told me that this should also provide some > relief regarding appetite and food cravings You don't have to have all of the symptoms of PCOS to have it. Some of the symptoms include: Acne, facial hair, male pattern balding, insulin resistance, infertility, lack of menstration, tendancy to carry extra weight around the middle. You've said that you've had a problem with acne and your body is fighting you to gain weight. Was most of your weight around the middle? Do you have any of the other symptoms? Check out www.soulcysters.com for a lot of detailed info. I had almost all of those symptoms, except for the baldness, that I've gotten under control. I take 1500 mg of glucophage xr daily for my PCOS. I also notice best results when I limit sugar carbs. The HMR shakes are chock fulla sugar, so I don't drink them anymore. Maybe you've been giving your body too much sugar by drinking them? Who knows... > Issue 2 is that I've had rising serum calcium levels since last summer and > it's still going up which means I have some sort of growth on one of the 4 [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > taking a full day off every week. I've decided not to enter any races in > April or May but I will be running the Dead Skunk 5 mile in June. I don't know much about this area, but it sure sounds like it is not fun to be going through. Why are they making you wait on the bone density? You get enough calcium and do enough impact type of exercise, your bones should be in great shape... But then again, I am not an expert. > That I hadn't completely given up on maintaining my weight loss in spite of > the effort it was taking was a Good Thing and something he doesn't see [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > just give up sugar, flour, and rice altogether as long as I was getting > sufficient carbs from vegetables, fruit, and dairy. Good Idea... I'm off of grains and sugar too, except for my daily oatmeal with berries and splenda. One word of caution about glucophage is that it can help with your fertility if you have PCOS. > I'll be using protein powder shakes with fruit for convenience and doing > something like Jayjay's meat and salad diet to limit myself to 1200-1500 [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > challenge and I never denied that, I just never expected it to be a constant > freakin fight. Thanks again for the support. I know it Jenn... but you just have to hang in there. Whatever you are going thru has to be better then the alternative. Besides, these problems would have most likely manifested anyway. I bet you "feel" better now at the weight and health level you are at... that should be enough incentive to keep going. Best wishes and keep us posted. > Jenn > You don't have to have all of the symptoms of PCOS to have it. and the endo has said I do not have it. I have a strong family history of diabetes though. > I limit sugar carbs. The HMR shakes are chock fulla sugar, so I don't drink > them anymore. Maybe you've been giving your body too much sugar by drinking > them? Who knows... The 120's are low-sugar and use the dreaded aspartame, but I haven't been using them much though I might be going back to them as the endo likes them. > > Issue 2 is that I've had rising serum calcium levels since last summer and > > it's still going up which means I have some sort of growth on one of the 4 [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > get enough calcium and do enough impact type of exercise, your bones should > be in great shape... But then again, I am not an expert. The calcium in my blood is coming from my bones as there is no other part of the body to get it from. I do plenty of weight bearing exercise to keep the bones healthy or at least it's assumed. The bones should be in great shape unless these glands are causing them to leach calcium. Cutting back on the high impact is a precaution that I'm willing to deal with for now. If I was truly a competitive runner and had a hope in hell of accomplishing anything with it then I'd probably get the scan (expensive) now, but the situation may reverse itself and I'm willing to wait. > > That I hadn't completely given up on maintaining my weight loss in spite > of [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > with berries and splenda. One word of caution about glucophage is that it > can help with your fertility if you have PCOS. I don't have fertility problems and never did. I've been able to get pregnant while on the pill (unintended) and two other times that I wanted to. My problems with pregnancies were structural not hormonal. This is another reason why the endo says that I do not have PCOS. > I know it Jenn... but you just have to hang in there. Whatever you are > going thru has to be better then the alternative. Besides, these problems > would have most likely manifested anyway. I bet you "feel" better now at > the weight and health level you are at... that should be enough incentive to > keep going. Best wishes and keep us posted. Actually I feel like crap and have been damn near suicidal at times. I've never been able to truly enjoy the weight loss as the constant dread and fear of regaining and the nightmare of actually putting on weight at uncontrollable levels (at times) has kept me relatively miserable for months. I've been told by multiple doctors, my shrink, and my trainer that I'm doing everything right and I've kept my weight within 30 lbs of my lowest weight, but unfortunately for me, the gains (even water ones) are what the brain sees and the self-image works with. I see a fat chick in the mirror even though no one else seems to see her. Just a few of the joys of the pathology of an eating disorder. "JMA" > and the endo has said I do not have it. I have a strong family history of > diabetes though. It is good you don't have it... I tell you it wrecked me in my 20's before I was diagnosed and treated. My acne was out of control. I am worried about having to go off my meds when/if I get pregnant and having symptoms come back again. > The calcium in my blood is coming from my bones as there is no other part of > the body to get it from. I do plenty of weight bearing exercise to keep the [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > with it then I'd probably get the scan (expensive) now, but the situation > may reverse itself and I'm willing to wait. That is so strange to me, but I am not a doctor. > I don't have fertility problems and never did. I've been able to get > pregnant while on the pill (unintended) and two other times that I wanted > to. My problems with pregnancies were structural not hormonal. This is > another reason why the endo says that I do not have PCOS. Ok good.... > Actually I feel like crap and have been damn near suicidal at times. I've > never been able to truly enjoy the weight loss as the constant dread and [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > mirror even though no one else seems to see her. Just a few of the joys of > the pathology of an eating disorder. Has the self image gotten better with treatment? I don't know what to say, except I hope you feel better about how you look one day. You can't live in fear from what *may* happen in the future. Hang in there, Jenn. > You don't have to have all of the symptoms of PCOS to have it. Some of the > symptoms include: Acne, facial hair, male pattern balding, insulin > resistance, infertility, lack of menstration, tendancy to carry extra weight > around the middle. oh, no... I've got a brain tumor... :-) Actually - I fit all those signs too - but mine is because of depo... not pcos - (I think). <ok, poor attempt at humor... > > I know it Jenn... but you just have to hang in there. Whatever you are > going thru has to be better then the alternative. Besides, these problems > would have most likely manifested anyway. I bet you "feel" better now at > the weight and health level you are at... that should be enough incentive to > keep going. Best wishes and keep us posted. PG, you've got a great point there. These thing would have manifested whether fat or not. I'm thinking that Jenn probably has a better chance of getting a good diagnosis and treatment at the lower weight than having all the other guesswork of problems related to obesity. > > You don't have to have all of the symptoms of PCOS to have it. Some of > the [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > getting a good diagnosis and treatment at the lower weight than having all > the other guesswork of problems related to obesity. I agree on that point. I'm sure I got better treatment as in more tests and more aggressive efforts to find out what's wrong than if I'd had these symptoms at 300 lbs - which oddly enough I did not. At that weight I had regular and normal periods, no androgen problems, and no edema. Both the gyn and the endo said that "normally we tell people to lose weight when these symptoms occur." The endo gave me the green light to lose weight slowly (not like I haven't been TRYING) until I get to my desired weight provided my period doesn't stop again like it did before. Jenn > "JMA" > [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > some >> relief regarding appetite and food cravings What makes me surprised about this is that about three months ago you reported having a fasting blood glucose of 70, which is a relatively low level and does not quite fit with the insulin resistance theory. I am just a bit surprised. Insulin resistance is checked with a relatively simple test called Glucose tolerance test. You are administered 75 grams of glucose and your blood sugar is measured a few times within the next few hours. It should not go above certain levels if you are a healthy person, then between some other levels you are considered IR, and above that you are a T2 diabetic. Would be interesting to see what your glucose levels were. It would not be surprising at all to see insulin resistance in you, given your history of binging on carbs and obesity. I am possibly also insulin resistant. One of 80 year old grandmas is a T2 and my dad is thick in midsection. They sell glucose monitors and test strips at Walmart. I recently bought a $8.99 ReliOn glucose monitor and 50 strips for $21. It is not too expensive for someone who wants to test himself/herself casually. I want to check my BG a few times and see if I am insulin resistant. You are right in that exercise and calorie restriction help. Metformin is supposedly a great drug, with some life prolonging effects as well. > You don't have to have all of the symptoms of PCOS to have it. Some of the > symptoms include: Acne, facial hair, male pattern balding, insulin > resistance, infertility, lack of menstration, tendancy to carry extra weight > around the middle. You've said that you've had a problem with acne and your > body is fighting you to gain weight. Was most of your weight around the > middle? it was, according to her fat picture. > Do you have any of the other symptoms? Check out > www.soulcysters.com for a lot of detailed info. I had almost all of those [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > them anymore. Maybe you've been giving your body too much sugar by drinking > them? Who knows... Supposedly, low carbing is extremely helpful to people with IR issues. That includes no sugar and starches. >> Issue 2 is that I've had rising serum calcium levels since last summer and >> it's still going up which means I have some sort of growth on one of the 4 >> parathyroid glands. have they done ultrasound scans etc? >> That I hadn't completely given up on maintaining my weight loss in >> spite > of the effort it was taking was a Good Thing and something >> he doesn't see often. That this kind of thing would occur *after* >> losing weight is > another oddity since technically I've done >> everything right to prevent type 2 diabetes. you may have had t2 diabetes that went under control as you lost weight. You do not have a prior reference point that I am aware of. >> We discussed diet and >> that I appear to be somewhat carb-sensitive. The endo didn't think >> it would be a bad thing for me to just give up sugar, flour, and >> rice altogether as long as I was getting sufficient carbs from >> vegetables, fruit, and dairy. A good idea for sure. >> I'll be using protein powder shakes with fruit for convenience and doing >> something like Jayjay's meat and salad diet to limit myself to 1200-1500 >> cal/day in 5-6 meals until I get down to my goal weight and the water > stuff >> finally stops. It's going to be *months* before I see any results from >> this - at least 6 months until the androgen reactions stop. no reason to be in a hurry. if it is easier to maintain in your 170's, you can as well stay in your 170s. >> I do completely understand how a person can do so much to lose >> weight and then give up. I've never totally given up, but it [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >> never denied that, I just never expected it to be a > constant >> freakin fight. Thanks again for the support. I am also mildly hungry much of the time, thankfully not in evenings and at night though. Sorry you have to be going through that. If you are really IR, thank God for losing weight. i Thanks for the update, Jenn. I admire your ability to stick to it with all the problems you've had recently. Many people would have given up. I hope this treatment works out for you. Beverly > Here's a brief summary of what I'm up against according to my > endocrinologist. I have two separate issues. [quoted text clipped - 43 lines] > > Jenn > Thanks for the update, Jenn. I admire your ability to stick to it with all > the problems you've had recently. Many people would have given up. I hope > this treatment works out for you. > > Beverly Thanks. I do appreciate the support even if I seem to be a bit negative and moody these days. Jenn Well, Jenn, it's good to have a diagnosis and a plan. I admire you for sticking to your diet through all this. And it sounds like you can now do so with more confidence that things will work out. Keep us posted -- we're here for you. Chris > Well, Jenn, it's good to have a diagnosis and a plan. I admire you > for sticking to your diet through all this. And it sounds like you [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > Chris Thanks. I thought about you today as I did my first bench presses with my trainer. We were discussing a new exercise plan that would put less emphasis on running and he asked if I was interested in power lifting. He's really pleased with how strong I've become in just a short time. I told him it was from carrying around all that extra body weight for so long. I declined for now but told him it was not out of the realm of possibilities... Jenn > Thanks. I thought about you today as I did my first bench presses with my > trainer. We were discussing a new exercise plan that would put less [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > declined for now but told him it was not out of the realm of > possibilities... Oh, you've just got to love it: somewhere on internet there's a cabal of older women secretly plotting to make power-lifting the next Pilates. I see their influence now. :-) (No doubt they are secretly worshiping the Goddess Squwaht.) Dally, "what is she blathering about now" > > Thanks. I thought about you today as I did my first bench presses with my > > trainer. We were discussing a new exercise plan that would put less [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > > Dally, "what is she blathering about now" heehee....I'm glad to be a part of this cabal ( there is no cabal..) Martha Why don't you want to get into power lifting? I would love to if I couldn't physically hurt myself due to my back/knee issues... "JMA" > Thanks. I thought about you today as I did my first bench presses with my > trainer. We were discussing a new exercise plan that would put less [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > Jenn > Why don't you want to get into power lifting? I would love to if I couldn't > physically hurt myself due to my back/knee issues... It's going to take a while to mentally get over not training for races right now. Next week I start assistant coaching the middle school track team and teaching my graduate class on the weekends - both of which will carry me through the middle of May. I'll still be running with the track team, but we only take them 2 miles. For whatever reason, as much as I enjoy my weightlifting I don't feel the need to push myself to the max like I do with running. <snip for length> > I'll be using protein powder shakes with fruit for convenience and doing > something like Jayjay's meat and salad diet to limit myself to 1200-1500 > cal/day in 5-6 meals until I get down to my goal weight and the water stuff > finally stops. It's going to be *months* before I see any results from > this - at least 6 months until the androgen reactions stop. <snicker, snort> You just made me almost get cottage cheese up my nose... As I sit here munching on a salad w/ a little roastbeef (deli) topped with a dressing of cottage cheese and salsa... You made my day with that comment. :-) > I do completely understand how a person can do so much to lose weight and > then give up. I've never totally given up, but it hasn't been easy at ALL. [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > challenge and I never denied that, I just never expected it to be a constant > freakin fight. Thanks again for the support. Jenn, you should be so damned proud of yourself for not giving up. You've been through quite a struggle and you are a total inspiration. To think, in the time you've been going thru this, I've just plain ol' gotten lazy, gave up on watching what I do and have gained about 15lbs. Seeing your post has totally put my current habits into perspective. You also have to know that whenever you feel a struggle - you've got your friends here to lean on for support. And also, my email will always be open to you, if there is anything I can do. You are a total inspiration. > > I'll be using protein powder shakes with fruit for convenience and doing > > something like Jayjay's meat and salad diet to limit myself to 1200-1500 [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > > You made my day with that comment. :-) I'm glad I could make someone's day today :) I've been doing a lot of the "dump a pouch of salmon or tuna" into the salad for dinner. Tonight's feast was cooked broccoli with a pouch of salmon and sugar free ranch dressing. It's fast, easy, and nutritious. The pouches are great for keeping at work too as long as I don't get sick of tuna and salmon. Jenn > > > I'll be using protein powder shakes with fruit for convenience and doing > > > something like Jayjay's meat and salad diet to limit myself to 1200-1500 [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > > Jenn there's your key... don't get sick of it. I did.. > I'm glad I could make someone's day today :) I've been doing a lot of the > "dump a pouch of salmon or tuna" into the salad for dinner. Tonight's feast > was cooked broccoli with a pouch of salmon and sugar free ranch dressing. > It's fast, easy, and nutritious. The pouches are great for keeping at work > too as long as I don't get sick of tuna and salmon. My latest meal in 10 seconds or less is a sliced up apple (I've got one of those devices that slices and cores it when you push the circle down through the apple) and I put the slices in a cereal bowl and spoon some natural peanut butter on it. Fiber, phytonutrients, protein and healthy fat that I can eat with my fingers. Voila. Actually, it's embarrassing to consider just how little time I've spent on food lately. I eat a lot of balance bars, some cottage cheese mixed with yogurt, etc. I cooked a meal once two weeks ago. (Funny/Sad story: my sister chastised me for being such a bad mother. I told her I had worked three days in a row of 9 am to 3 am the week she was complaining about. She said that wasn't too difficult a schedule. It took me a little while to figure out she had thought I said 9 am to 3 pm.) Dally > Jenn, you should be so damned proud of yourself for not giving up. You've > been through quite a struggle and you are a total inspiration. To think, [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > friends here to lean on for support. And also, my email will always be open > to you, if there is anything I can do. You are a total inspiration. Ditto. (thanks for letting me crib your words, Jayjay, I'm tight on time and mostly just lurking.) Dally >I do completely understand how a person can do so much to lose weight and >then give up. I've never totally given up, but it hasn't been easy at ALL. [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > >Jenn Jenn I'm full of admiration for the way in which you've managed to hold on through all this and not go back to your previous eating behaviour. I honestly don't think I am strong enough to have been able to do that. I believe that this will make you even stronger for the coming weeks. janice 233/177/133 > I believe that this will make you even stronger for the coming weeks. I think it will be a little easier if what the doctor said actually happens and the medication alleviates the cravings and lowers my appetite. I wasn't experiencing mild hunger - it was the kind that would drive a person to eat the paint off of the walls. It will also help if I start to see weight loss happen again at a more reasonable calorie level for my weight. Thanks for the support. Jenn "JMA" wrote: >I do completely understand how a person can do so much to lose weight >and then give up. I've never totally given up, but it hasn't been easy [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >would be a challenge and I never denied that, I just never expected it >to be a constant freakin fight. Thanks again for the support. Jenn, we're all here to commiserate and cheer you on too. Sending good vibes, prayers, smoke signals <insert favorite inspirational symbol here> and love <s>.  SignatureWalking on . . . Laurie in Maine 207/110 60 inches of attitude! Start: 2/02 Maintained since 2/03 I am so relieved that you have an answer and one that you can work with. I can't imagine what a challenge it has been for you with your hormones out of whack but I honestly believe that you would have been even more of a hormonal train wreck without the diet and exercise! Good luck and keep us posted. Did he do anything about the low estrogen levels? Did he say anything about using Soy Protein for partial relief? j > Here's a brief summary of what I'm up against according to my > endocrinologist. I have two separate issues. [quoted text clipped - 43 lines] > > Jenn > I am so relieved that you have an answer and one that you can work with. I > can't imagine what a challenge it has been for you with your hormones out of [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > Good luck and keep us posted. Did he do anything about the low estrogen > levels? Did he say anything about using Soy Protein for partial relief? Actually he thinks the estrogen will come up as the dhea and testosterone come down from the insulin control. The estrogen is also tied into the calcium thing since the parathyroids respond to estrogen levels so go figure. Right now concern #1 is getting my body acclimated to the metformin - it will take a month to get to my actual daily dose. I'm not supposed to play around with any supplements right now, not even a multivitamin which is why we talked about using HMR shakes (nutritionally dense) as a part of my weight loss plan for now. I do eat soy regularly and always have since I'm not a big red meat eater. I usually have boca burgers a few times a week and I like some soy cheeses. > I do completely understand how a person can do so much to lose weight and > then give up. I've never totally given up, but it hasn't been easy at ALL. [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > challenge and I never denied that, I just never expected it to be a constant > freakin fight. Thanks again for the support. Hang in there, Jenn. It'll get better--it has to. At least you have some answers now, and with a little luck, soon you'll get the results you deserve, and will feel better too. I can relate to what you're going through (not exactly the same symptoms, but definitely the same weight issues) and it really stinks. You want to give up. Why work if it's not going to get you anywhere? If you're gonna gain weight on broccoli, why not just eat some damn cookies? Well, just think of how much worse off you'd be if you hadn't been working so hard. Tally up all of those calories you've burned off exercising, divide 'em by 3500 (or even less if your metabolism's slow), and see how much more you'd weigh if you had given up. Good job on sticking to your plan, and good luck with the treatment. -Alison Boy what a report, hope the meds kick in real soon that your giant effort will be rewarded. Michelle Ozzie in Switzerland (who's been on too many ski holidays ;-) WW WI 69.8 / 63.5 / 61kg 134 lbs >Here's a brief summary of what I'm up against according to my >endocrinologist. I have two separate issues. [quoted text clipped - 43 lines] > >Jenn >Boy what a report, hope the meds kick in real soon that your giant >effort will be rewarded. >Michelle >Ozzie in Switzerland (who's been on too many ski holidays ;-) > >WW WI 69.8 / 63.5 / 61kg 134 lbs ANd where have you been? I haven't seen you around in a while. Your numbers look good. On skiing holiday. Back now hope to post more, boy it was a great season here, 4 weeks of deep powder and 1 week of spring snow. Mmmm it is snowing now so maybe skiing over easter too :-) Michelle Ozzie in Switzerland (who's been on too many ski holidays ;-) WW WI 69.8 / 63.5 / 61kg 134 lbs >>Boy what a report, hope the meds kick in real soon that your giant >>effort will be rewarded. [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] >ANd where have you been? I haven't seen you around in a while. Your >numbers look good. >On skiing holiday. Back now hope to post more, boy it was a great >season here, 4 weeks of deep powder and 1 week of spring snow. Mmmm >it is snowing now so maybe skiing over easter too :-) > >Michelle >Ozzie in Switzerland (who's been on too many ski holidays ;-) LOL... sounds like you've had way too much fun!!! Nah no such thing as too much fun, by the way it has snowed lightly for the last 3 days here so looks like I have to go skking again on Sunday, shame ;-) Michelle Ozzie in Switzerland WW WI 69.8 / 62.2 / 61kg 134 lbs >>On skiing holiday. Back now hope to post more, boy it was a great >>season here, 4 weeks of deep powder and 1 week of spring snow. Mmmm [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > >LOL... sounds like you've had way too much fun!!! |
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