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Weight Loss Forum / General Topics / August 2004Interesting Documentary on Discovery Health Last Night...
Not sure if anyone's seen it, it was called "Trash Can of Skin" about a British woman that lost 309lbs in 2 years and came to America to have a radical surgery to remove the loose skin from her body. I think they said she was losing 1/3 of her skin through the surgeries. They took out 35lbs of fat & skin from her first surgery, she's still got several more to go. Interestingly enough, she lost weight by portion control & exercise! She lost an average of 12lbs/month over 2 years(which is where I am currently). A little sobering, I'm afraid I may have to go down that road as well if I cannot find a way to tighten or tone up my arms & stomach as I lose weight. Total cost to her was around $150,000 for the surgeries, none of it covered by health insurance. She was in a car accident, that's what triggered her weight gain(as she says), I would imagine that she got some sort of settlement from that so she could pay for the surgeries. Here's the episode link, it's on again on 08/01/04 @ 11am EST: http://health.discovery.com/schedule/series.jsp?series=86963&gid=0&channel=DHC Matty PS - I mowed the entire lawn again last night and wasn't as winded before, which is a plus! The link to the article does not work. Congrats on mowing the lawn. You must be a very muscular and strong man, I know that if I had extra 240 lbs on me, I would not be able to mow a lawn. So, if you keep your muscle through some basic exercise (squats, chair or countertop pushups), you are going to end up very muscular! Regarding skin, some people's skin shrinks very well. You are pretty young, if I remember right you must be in your early thirties. If so, there is a good chance that your skin will behave relatively well, or at least, better. Elasticity of the skin is the inverse of degree to which collagen becomes cross-linked (the strands of collagen in the skin become joined to one another). That cross linking is a feature of aging, and the speed of aging wrt collagen crosslinking is determined by the glycation process, that is, the level of glucose in the blood. If you are young and have no blood sugar problems, you have better expectations. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=8 168645&dopt=Abstract i So what can us older folks do to tighten things up? MJ > The link to the article does not work. Congrats on mowing the > lawn. You must be a very muscular and strong man, I know that if I had [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > If you are young and have no blood sugar problems, you have better > expectations. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_ui ds=8168645&dopt=Abstract > i > So what can us older folks do to tighten things up? I have no idea... Great question though. i > MJ >> The link to the article does not work. Congrats on mowing the [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] >> >> i > So what can us older folks do to tighten things up? Hope, pray, and try to build some muscle to help fill some of it out.  Signaturejamie (jamiemck@newsguy.com) "There's a seeker born every minute." > So what can us older folks do to tighten things up? Lotion, lotion, lotion! SignatureWalking (but mostly biking!) on . . . Laurie in Maine 207/110 60 inches of attitude! Start: 2/02 Maintained since 2/03 >> So what can us older folks do to tighten things up? > > Lotion, lotion, lotion! Lotion merely moistens the dead outermost layer. Signaturejamie (jamiemck@newsguy.com) "There's a seeker born every minute." > Lotion merely moistens the dead outermost layer. Loofah first ;-) SignatureWalking (but mostly biking!) on . . . Laurie in Maine 207/110 60 inches of attitude! Start: 2/02 Maintained since 2/03 >> Lotion merely moistens the dead outermost layer. > > Loofah first ;-) Then it moistens the *new* dead outermost layer. It can't penetrate the moisture barrier. Signaturejamie (jamiemck@newsguy.com) "There's a seeker born every minute." > Then it moistens the *new* dead outermost layer. It can't > penetrate the moisture barrier. hmph. At least you'll *smell* good - now let me have my fantasy, ok? SignatureWalking (but mostly biking!) on . . . Laurie in Maine 207/110 60 inches of attitude! Start: 2/02 Maintained since 2/03 >> Then it moistens the *new* dead outermost layer. It can't >> penetrate the moisture barrier. > > hmph. At least you'll *smell* good - now let me have my fantasy, ok? So long as you're into weight-loss fantasies, you might as well try the "fat-burning soap." Signaturejamie (jamiemck@newsguy.com) "There's a seeker born every minute." > >> So what can us older folks do to tighten things up? > > > > Lotion, lotion, lotion! > > Lotion merely moistens the dead outermost layer. Yes, but it's still very pleasant to get a good massage along with the lotion. :p Actually, some expert think it's the massage that it doing most of the job, not the lotion. Massage *does* things to the inner layers of the skin. It helps break up fat clusters. For instance, good old "draining" hand massage is actually the best non-surgical way to reduce cellulite... > "jamie" <jamie@spam-me-silly.net> wrote in message >> > Lotion, lotion, lotion! [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > helps break up fat clusters. For instance, good old "draining" hand massage > is actually the best non-surgical way to reduce cellulite... Last I read, very vigorous massage and endermologie (special massage with suction rollers) are believed to reduce the *appearance* of cellulite by causing mild swelling in the skin that reduces the puckered appearance for a while. It's a shrinking of connective tissue fibers between the fat clusters that causes the cellulite look, and it's largely hereditary. The angle and thickness of connective tissue fibers is different in most women from most men, so men almost never have cellulite. I suspect you'd really have to beat the crap out of the someone to break up those fibers or "break up fat clusters", and I would think that would cause significant bruising. It's not that easy to break up fat clusters in chicken skin or on a steak with your fingers directly IN the fat and pinching it, never mind trying to to it from outside a person. Signaturejamie (jamiemck@newsguy.com) "There's a seeker born every minute." >> "jamie" <jamie@spam-me-silly.net> wrote in message >>> > Lotion, lotion, lotion! [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] >IN the fat and pinching it, never mind trying to to it from outside >a person. Ahmed, my Olympic lifting trainer and also my masseur, does this sort of massage sometimes for women who are fitness models. He says it's very painful -- "You don't want to try it, believe me!". I think I'll pass. I do get regular deep tissue massages with him, though, almost every week. Chris > Last I read, very vigorous massage and endermologie (special massage > with suction rollers) are believed to reduce the *appearance* of > cellulite by causing mild swelling in the skin that reduces the > puckered appearance for a while. Yes, that's what I was talking about... Though hand massages work better than the suction rollers. Appearance is really the only problem with cellulite, it's not like it's bad for health or anything (being on the legs and butt, it's pure gynoid harmless fat). Most women are not very concerned about having "virtual" cellulite, they're concerned about it showing when they're in bikini ;) Besides, there is not much to do against cellulite, except surgery. Most non invasive methods do nothing at all, at least massages can make it look better, that's still an improvement... > The angle > and thickness of connective tissue fibers is different in most women > from most men, so men almost never have cellulite. Well, we get the hair loss, the heart diseases, several years less in life expectancy... We do have to have some advantage somewhere :p > Not sure if anyone's seen it, it was called "Trash Can of Skin" about a > British woman that lost 309lbs in 2 years and came to America to have a [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > lost an average of 12lbs/month over 2 years(which is where I am > currently). A recent thread on ASD asked why losing faster isn't better. Here's yet another reason why - Lose slowly enough and your skin should be able to shrink as your stored fat does. Lose too fast and you could end up with extra skin. > A little sobering, I'm afraid I may have to go down that road as well if > I cannot find a way to tighten or tone up my arms & stomach as I lose > weight. Stay active, take your time, and be as young as possible when your start losing. Two of those three are under your control at least somewhat. >A recent thread on ASD asked why losing faster isn't better. Here's >yet another reason why - Lose slowly enough and your skin should be >able to shrink as your stored fat does. Lose too fast and you could >end up with extra skin. Well, I hate to disillusion anyone, but this is a rather over-optimistic statement for those of us who are older and have a fair bit of weight to lose. I lost my weight at only a little over a pound a week, and I certainly have extra skin. It's not nearly as bad as it might be -- probably partly due to the slow weight loss, but also, I think, to how I carried the weight, continuing exercise, and just some genetic luck of the draw. But I doubt I'll ever want to wear a bikini in public :-). I don't think there's much evidence to support such a generalization as you've made above (i.e., lose slowly enough and your skin will shrink to fit). I think almost all 100+ pound losers are going to end up with some excess tissue, regardless of speed of weight loss. Chris 262/143/ (145-150) > >A recent thread on ASD asked why losing faster isn't better. Here's > >yet another reason why - Lose slowly enough and your skin should be > >able to shrink as your stored fat does. Lose too fast and you could > >end up with extra skin. > I don't think there's much evidence to support such a generalization > as you've made above (i.e., lose slowly enough and your skin will > shrink to fit). I think almost all 100+ pound losers are going to end > up with some excess tissue, regardless of speed of weight loss. That's pretty much what my plastic surgeon said. He also said that besides genetics, how *long* you were overweight plays a part too. Everyone is different - go figure. BTW for anyone considering the surgery to remove excess skin, a good surgeon will insist that you keep your weight stable for *at least* a year before performing the surgery. Mine recommended 2 or 3 years, but would do the surgery after 1 year if there were other problems associated with the skin. Jenn > BTW for anyone considering the surgery to remove excess skin, a good surgeon > will insist that you keep your weight stable for *at least* a year before > performing the surgery. Mine recommended 2 or 3 years, but would do the > surgery after 1 year if there were other problems associated with the skin. That's good advice... Statistics say that the average rate of success of diets is around 15% when you study them at the 5 years point. Not being a success doesn't mean being an utter failure, it just means gaining back a significant part of the original weight, it doesn't have to be all the weight. The problem is that if you have surgery to remove skin too soon *and* gain back a large amount of weight, the remaining skin will get stretched so hard and fast (weight regain can be explosive) that it is likely to be ruined beyong repair if you ever re-lose that weight again. Even worse if you regain weight right after the surgery while the tissues are still healing... Likewise if you keep losing weight after the surgery, you might need a second operation. So, responsible surgeons prefer to play it safe and make sure your weight is indeed stable. > > BTW for anyone considering the surgery to remove excess skin, a good > surgeon [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > So, responsible surgeons prefer to play it safe and make sure your weight is > indeed stable. I was told that elasticity all but disappears after the first surgery. Any further weight loss results in loose skin and there are people who have had multiple surgeries. Not that this has bearing on real life, but the FX show Nip/Tuck currently has a storyline about a woman who gained a bunch of weight after liposuction. It's on Tuesday nights @9 central time, but it's kind gruesome (very real looking surgery scenes), raunchy (language and sex), and soap operatic...making it a must see in our household. Jenn > > A recent thread on ASD asked why losing faster isn't better. Here's > > yet another reason why - Lose slowly enough and your skin should be [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > as you've made above (i.e., lose slowly enough and your skin will > shrink to fit). You just posted that it's a great partial strategy and the best known strategy. Until a complete solution comes out, partial is the best that can be done. Given the choice between partial and none, I'll take partial. > I think almost all 100+ pound losers are going to end > up with some excess tissue, regardless of speed of weight loss. Some is a lot better than a lot. You are an excellent role model for that reducing excess skin along with your other successes. >> > A recent thread on ASD asked why losing faster isn't better. Here's >> > yet another reason why - Lose slowly enough and your skin should be [quoted text clipped - 25 lines] >model for that reducing excess skin along with your other >successes. I agree that's a partial strategy. However, your post was stated in absolute terms, and I felt that it offered unrealistic expectations. Some people are very disappointed to find they don't have a model's body after a big weight loss, and it's better to not expect the impossible, or to feel there's something wrong with oneself if that isn't what happens. Chris > I agree that's a partial strategy. However, your post was stated in > absolute terms, and I felt that it offered unrealistic expectations. > Some people are very disappointed to find they don't have a model's > body after a big weight loss, and it's better to not expect the > impossible, or to feel there's something wrong with oneself if that > isn't what happens. and of course, they didn't have a model's body *ever before*, but think losing weight will magically reveal one? SignatureWalking (but mostly biking!) on . . . Laurie in Maine 207/110 60 inches of attitude! Start: 2/02 Maintained since 2/03 >>A recent thread on ASD asked why losing faster isn't better. Here's >>yet another reason why - Lose slowly enough and your skin should be [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] >Chris >262/143/ (145-150) I do think age has a lot to do with it. It's well known that the skin loses a lot of its elasticity as we get older, and it's asking a lot of older skin to fit a body that's several clothing sizes smaller. I've noticed a great difference with loose skin when I lose weight as I've got older - when I was in my 20s and 30s, and probably even my 40s, I took it for granted that my skin would stretch and shrink to fit whateve size my body happened to be. Perhaps how many times over you've lost and regained is also a factor here. janice 233/181/133 Blanket statements and generalizations serve only to breed FUD, whether it's about loose skin after massive weight loss, or any particular WOE. My sig says it all _ your mileage may vary. As always, YMMV. Kasey 365/253/??? > A recent thread on ASD asked why losing faster isn't better. Here's > yet another reason why - Lose slowly enough and your skin should be > able to shrink as your stored fat does. Lose too fast and you could > end up with extra skin. Usually skin is elastic enough to adapt to a new configuration if it is ever going to. I suspect the main point of losing slowly is that you usually do that through a reasonnable diet, not a crash one. Thus, you are less likely to suffer from nutritional deficiencies. The skin is very sensitive to lack of vitamins and proper essential fatty acids. Especially during a diet, where you're asking your skin to do some extra work to shrink to your new body configuration. Losing weight very quickly through a powder diet with no fats and bad quality proteins and low quality vitamins *is* going to hurt your skin. Especially if you add dehydratation to that, which is common in many diets... |
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